Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 06, 2013 05:49PM |
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When you disagree, it makes you liable to present evidence.
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Are you implying that since Gurbani says one must engage in Naam Simran 24/7, it negates the concept of Amrit Vela or getting up early in the morning to do Simran?
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My question is simply to understand what you are trying to say. It is better to explain using Gurbani what you mean and why you disagree. A statement without any evidence lacks conclusion, rationality and is most likely fallacious.
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So if you have grown tired of "Sikh Philosophy" forum and are looking for a new place to stir things up, might as well be honest and upfront about your viewpoint and then have a discussion.
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 07, 2013 07:06AM |
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 07, 2013 10:10AM |
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 07, 2013 10:53AM |
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To accuse some one of the above in bold is uncalled for and you are not only accusing me but the SGGS, our only Guru which is a shame.
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I just searched the word AMRIT at Srigranth. org and found that it is mentioned 31 times. Now, it is up to you to read those Shabads and find out for yourself.
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Are you insecure about yourself an in your Sikhi stance that you accuse me of stirring things up?
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 07, 2013 10:57AM |
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 07, 2013 11:02AM |
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 07, 2013 01:28PM |
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Please inform us if you believe in getting up at early morning hours or not? It does not matter what name you give to this time, the main thing is that a Sikh must wake up during early morning hours and engage in Sifat-Salaah of Vaheguru, through Naam-Gurmantr and Gurbani.
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You can call this time Amritvela, Prabhaat, Jhaalangay or Chauthah-Pehar etc. but you cannot deny the importance of this time in Gurmat.
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 07, 2013 04:48PM |
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Sorry to disappoint you but the same goes for you and for everyone else. It is rather self serving, self-centered and egotistical on our part to even ask that to others. We should all stick to our individual relationships with The One. Many Sikhs work night shifts,grave yards etc etc. So, one should ask what is the time to immerse in Amrit (Amrit Vela) for them. I also personally know many Sikhs who get up at 2AM, parrot for sometime and then go off to sleep.
So, you will never find that out by asking me such a question. My relationship is between myself and Ik Ong Kaar as is yours. Having said that, I have been an early riser as far as I can remember and luckily, I never had to work night shifts nor grave yard shifts.
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You are not being honest here I am afraid which I am surprised about as it is coming from you. I never denied anything. Please show me a single post of mine where I denied that you accuse me of.
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We all know that there are 8 pehars and we also know the day starts at 12AM. So, can you please tell me what duration of time Chauthah-pehar comes in based on that mathematically speaking? I would appreciate that.
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 07, 2013 06:40PM |
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I did not ask you if you get up at Amritvela or not. All I asked was if you believe that this is a principle of Gurmat to get up at early hours of the morning. I think this is a fair question because
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Please inform us if you believe in getting up at early morning hours or not?
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 07, 2013 06:55PM |
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I did not ask you if you get up at Amritvela or not. All I asked was if you believe that this is a principle of Gurmat to get up at early hours of the morning. I think this is a fair question because
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Please inform us if you believe in getting up at early morning hours or not?
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Your original question was "Which Vela is NOT Amrit Vela based on SGGS, our only Guru?" From this question we can deduce that you may not be a believer in 4th Pehar of the night to be Amritvela. We asked you a simple question and this question can be answered in a simple yes or no. There is no need to get defensive over this.
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This is what I was told once
6 AM - 9 AM peher 1
9 AM - 12 PM peher 2
12 PM - 3 PM peher 3
3 PM - 6 PM peher 4 (probably Rehras time ??)
6 PM - 9 PM peher 5
9 PM - 12 AM peher 6
12 AM - 3 AM peher 7
3 AM - 6 AM peher 8 (I think this 1 is Amritvela)
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The days starts at 12 am, as per Western way of calculating time. This is not how the day begins in our culture. The days begins when the sun rises. We should not mix Pehar system of calculating time with 24 hour system (the Western system). Chautha Pehar typically means the last quarter of the night.
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 07, 2013 07:54PM |
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Tejwant Singh jeeo,
Please inform us if you believe in getting up at early morning hours or not? It does not matter what name you give to this time, the main thing is that a Sikh must wake up during early morning hours and engage in Sifat-Salaah of Vaheguru, through Naam-Gurmantr and Gurbani. You can call this time Amritvela, Prabhaat, Jhaalangay or Chauthah-Pehar etc. but you cannot deny the importance of this time in Gurmat.
Sure, any time when we are engaged in doing Sifat-Salaah of Vaheguru, that time is Amritmai but this does not negate the early morning hours of Bhagti.
Kulbir Singh
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 07, 2013 08:30PM |
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What time span is 4th Pehar?
According to Mehtab Singh ji post (I do not know if it is the same gentleman who participates in this forum or not) on:
[www.sikhsangat.com]
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This is what I was told once
6 AM - 9 AM peher 1
9 AM - 12 PM peher 2
12 PM - 3 PM peher 3
3 PM - 6 PM peher 4 (probably Rehras time ??)
6 PM - 9 PM peher 5
9 PM - 12 AM peher 6
12 AM - 3 AM peher 7
3 AM - 6 AM peher 8 (I think this 1 is Amritvela)
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The days starts at 12 am, as per Western way of calculating time. This is not how the day begins in our culture. The days begins when the sun rises. We should not mix Pehar system of calculating time with 24 hour system (the Western system). Chautha Pehar typically means the last quarter of the night.
OK, I will take your word for it. Then do you mean Mehatab Singh ji is wrong?
Secondly, we all know that DUPEHAR= 2nd Pehar is the 3 hour period starting from mid day to 3 PM. So, then how come "Chautha Pehar typically means the last quarter of the night" and what does typically mean in your post?
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 07, 2013 08:36PM |
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Secondly, we all know that DUPEHAR= 2nd Pehar is the 3 hour period starting from mid day to 3 PM. So, then how come "Chautha Pehar typically means the last quarter of the night" and what does typically mean in your post?
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 07, 2013 08:58PM |
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 07, 2013 09:24PM |
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In Gurbani Pehars are used to explain time. The term Atthe pehar (8 pehar) does not mean that there are 8 pehars in a day. There are 4 pehars in the day and 4 pehars in the night. These put together equal the 24 hour "day" that we are familiar with in modern times. So when in Gurbani Guru Sahib says to wake up at the 4th pehar, it means to wake up at the 4th pehar of the night.
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These are not hard measurements but are quite fluid. That is why the term typically is used. In puratan times there were no clocks and the measurement of time was a general measurement that was not the same every time. They would judge the starting of the day on the rise of the sun, and we know that the rise of the sun changes due to seasons.
It is also understood that the same term can have different meaning in different uses.
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 07, 2013 09:29PM |
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Tejwant Singh
You dont have to believe in what you dont want to accept. No one is forcing you to. Having a weakness is one thing, but totally denying a certain principle is another. I think we all should draw the line somewhere between right and wrong. You dont have to wake up at early hours if you dont want to, but stop arguing. Go and get a life, go do something worthwhile, rather wasting your time and making others spend their time in arguing with you. Do you know of a life outside of the computer screen, keyboard, mouse and internet.....I think there is one, go and explore and you will I am right!
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 08, 2013 02:07AM |
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 08, 2013 03:08AM |
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 08, 2013 06:58AM |
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I fail to understand why so much anger and ire from a beautiful name like yours. I never said I did not accept getting up in the early morning, in fact I do. Please read my post regarding this. I do not accept that Amirt Vela is early in the morning. Anytime for me is the Time for Amrit as mentioned several time. I have no idea why you are against that.
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 08, 2013 11:40AM |
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First you had declared that you would never let anyone know if you get up in the early morning hours or not because this is between you and "Ik Onkar" but now few posts later you have informed us that you do get up early morning. Thanks!
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I did not ask you if you get up at Amritvela or not. All I asked was if you believe that this is a principle of Gurmat to get up at early hours of the morning. I think this is a fair question because
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First you had declared that you would never let anyone know if you get up in the early morning hours or not because this is between you and "Ik Onkar" but now few posts later you have informed us that you do get up early morning. Thanks!
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 08, 2013 11:57AM |
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 09, 2013 01:50AM |
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 09, 2013 06:13AM |
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 09, 2013 06:53AM |
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 09, 2013 12:47PM |
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 09, 2013 03:27PM |
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 09, 2013 03:32PM |
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 09, 2013 06:51PM |
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ਤੇਜਵੰਤ uncle ji,
Please ਏਸ ਸਲੋਕ ਦੇ ਤੁਹਾਡੇ ਮੁਤਾਬਿਕ ਕੀ ਅਰਥ ਬਣਦੇ ਹਨ , ਦੱਸਿਓ ਜੀ :
ਫਰੀਦਾ ਪਿਛਲ ਰਾਤਿ ਨ ਜਾਗਿਓਹਿ ਜੀਵਦੜੋ ਮੁਇਓਹਿ ॥ ਜੇ ਤੈ ਰਬੁ ਵਿਸਾਰਿਆ ਤ ਰਬਿ ਨ ਵਿਸਰਿਓਹਿ ॥੧੦੭॥
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Tejwant ji,
if u are in sehaj why so critical...just as you accuse Bhai Kulbir Singh Jio of being dishonest, what about your intentions ji??
this post was to address time for Amritvela, and how to achieve it if sleep is an obstacle ji.
bhul chuk muaf Waheguru
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Bhai Tejwant Singh jee
Please keep to the topic and do not get side tracked with talk of dishonesty.
All Gursikhs have risen at Amritvela since the times of Sri Guru Nanak Dev jee there is no doubt on this. Many historical Sources can prove this and most of all GurbaNee and RehitNameh prove that rising for morning Bhagti is essential.
Please read through articles on the site and Arth Bodh from many Gursikhs who have explained the importance of Amritvela.
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 10, 2013 02:03AM |
Re: A consistent Amrit Vela June 10, 2013 05:53AM |