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Dhaarna

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Anonymous User
Dhaarna
June 22, 2011 08:34AM
Could somebody please explain the history and importance (if there is any) of Dhaarna?
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Re: Dhaarna
June 22, 2011 08:51AM
Not sure if Dhaarna existed in the pre-Sant Attar Singh period but Dhaarna were popularized by Sant Attar Singh jee as a way to do Parchaar of Sikhi. The uneducated rural people, particularly of Malwa region, were very receptive of this style and many took Amrit. Later on many prominent Sants e.g. Sant Rarewale, used the Dhaarna style of singing to do Parchaar.

There were some advantages of this style of singing but there are also many disadvantages:

1. At one time it had the potential to take over real Kirtan - singing of praises of Vaheguru through Gurbani.

2. It reduces the importance of Gurbani particularly when uneducated and uninformed people refer to Dhaarna singing as Kirtan. At best, Dhaarna can be equated with Dhaadi Vaar or Kavishri but never with Amrit Kirtan of Amrit Gurbani.

3. Dhaarna involves singing on pattern of Gurbani Kirtan but of man-made poems. If Dhaarna form of singing is accepted then what is there to stop future Sikh converts in foreign lands to start singing poems of their local languages and then calling it Kirtan? There could be Dhaarna kind of singing in Tamil, Chinese, English, French.

4. Singing of Kachi Baani i.e. man-made poems is not Kalyaankaari like Gurbani is. Gurbani has Paaras Kala which means that just by singing Gurbani, one can get Param-gatt.

At one point, perhaps, singing Dhaarna was good but today it should be stopped altogether. With little attempt, most people can understand Gurbani. Sometimes it seems so ridiculous when they sing their own man-made poems that are translations of very easy Gurbani Pankitis e.g. instead of singing Sadho Man ka Maan Tyaago|| they would sing something like Man da Maan chhadd de oye Saadha|| What's the point of singing Dhaarna in this case, when the original Baani is so easy to understand?

For hundreds of years, Sikhs continued to sing Gurbani alone (or acceptable Baani e.g. Bhai Gurdaas jee's Vaars); what's the need to change this and start singing Dhaarna now?

Kulbir Singh
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Re: Dhaarna
June 22, 2011 10:07AM
Wasn't there a incident where Bhai Sahib Bhai Randhir Singh jee met Baba Attar Singh jee., they discussed about dharnaa....?
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Anonymous User
Re: Dhaarna
June 23, 2011 10:25AM
Thank you Bhai Kulbir Singh Jeeo. The reason I ask was because there is a growing tend of Jatha Singhs who are now doing more and more dhaarna instead of Keertan. There is a new jatha called 'Nirvair Khalsa Jatha' or something where JAtha Singhs are doing amazing parchar, but dhaarna rather than Akhand Keertan. They are following the footsteps of ranjit Singh dhadrianwale. Surely it would be better to do Akhand Keertan than dhaarna??
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Re: Dhaarna
June 23, 2011 05:49PM
Waheguru Je Ka Khalsa Waheguru Je Ke Fateh!!

Dharana - the modern translation of it is INCANTATIONS- that is all it is just incantations - and you know when you sing an incantation such as
" Guru ghar jaa kee sevaa karnee" etc etc. -- Keep singing it over and over and your thought process may actually make you do seva in a Guru Ghar. At the end of the day they seem to be training the mind. However as Kulbir Singh jee says if Gurbani is there then why NOT SING IT properly with protocol, with prem , bhavana - surely it's where we need to end up with isn't it as an individual goal or sangtee roop?

Guru Sahibhan designed beautiful insruments such as rebaab,saranda to sing kirtan from in raag, however we design our own tools such as dharan - and filimi tunes for kirtan. Why is it that we sikhs are brillant at reinventing the wheel but not take pride in keeping traditions is beyone me.?
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Re: Dhaarna
June 24, 2011 10:20AM
VAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA, VAHEGURU JI KI FATEH

Dhaarna can be thought of as a Katha set to rhyme and tune. Commonly, Dhaarna is started by singing a Gurbani Shabad, and the consequent Dhaarna is a Katha of that Shabad/history that can be derived from the Shabad, based on either slight modifications of the Gurbani Shabad (adding things like Ji, changing the order of the words, etc.) or compositions of the singer/other singers to further clarify the Shabad.

That is the intent of Dhaarna. The idea of Dhaarna was to bring the message of Gurbani to the masses. Not all Sikhs can easily understand Gurbani, not all are attracted to Katha (some of which use very complicated language). This was the tool that spread Sikhi into many villages and pinds and continues to be successful to that end. Parchariks such as Baba Ranjit Singh are successfully doing parchar of Sikhi and are causing people to go towards Sikhi. Note that Baba Ranjit Singh has, on multiple occasions, stated plainly to never call Dhaarna Keertan or Bani/Gurbani, but equate it on the level of Katha.

Nirvair Khalsa Jatha is, from what it looks like from their Flickr account, the same Sikhs who accompany Baba Ranjit Singh.

[www.flickr.com]

Guru Sahib has made many ways of doing parchar. Some are interested in Katha, some in Keertan, some in Ddhadi Vaaran, some in Dhaarna, some in seva, some in martial arts and so on, so forth. So each has its place. I cannot question the decisions of Mahapurakhs such as Baba Attar Singh, whose parchar literally transformed villages upon villages, through Dhaarna. Per the conversation of Bhai Sahib Bhai Randhir Singh and Baba Attar Singh when Baba Ji was asked about Dhaarna, Baba Ji replied that its entire purpose was to take the person towards Simran and Shudh Gurbani. If Bhai Sahib Bhai Randhir Singh Ji was so against Dhaarna, he would have openly protested and called out Baba Attar Singh Ji. But he did not and remained in good relations with him, which suggests that he respected the difference the means of doing parchar (even if he did not agree with it).
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Re: Dhaarna
June 24, 2011 03:27PM
sathiguroo binaa hor kachee hai baanee ||
baanee th kachee sathiguroo baajhahu hor kachee baanee ||
kehadhae kachae sunadhae kachae kacha(n)aee aakh vakhaanee ||
har har nith karehi rasanaa kehiaa kashhoo n jaanee ||
chith jin kaa hir laeiaa maaeiaa bolan peae ravaanee ||
kehai naanak sathiguroo baajhahu hor kachee baanee ||24||
gur kaa sabadh ratha(n)n hai heerae jith jarraao ||
sabadh rathan jith ma(n)n laagaa eaehu hoaa samaao ||
sabadh saethee man miliaa sachai laaeiaa bhaao ||
aapae heeraa rathan aapae jis no dhaee bujhaae ||
kehai naanak sabadh rathan hai heeraa jith jarraao ||25||
wjkk wjkf, was this shabad is in favour of dhaarna.Was Guru Sahib wrong to gave us so costly gurbanni and that in larriwar.In past there was no school colleges.But gursikh have darshsan of guru sahib from larrivar sarup and not only darshan but also kanth even many banis in their nitnem.But now in present their are so many colleges schools,Their are degree of "GYANI" in punjabi but we are disabled to read gurbani and take support of dharnaa kachi baani.Next one we explained that BHAI RANDHIR SINGH JI met SANT ATTAR SINGH,SANT ISHER SINGH which sings dhaarna.But dass disagreed that bhai sahib not point out to sants of waying of their parchar. bhag heen bhram chotan khave
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Re: Dhaarna
June 28, 2011 06:13AM
Nirvair Khalsa Jatha is the Jatha of Singhs that do Parchaar with Baba Ranjit Singh Ji - this is the name of the Jatha in India, and there is a unit in the UK. Of the UK unit, a number of the Singhs became Amritdhari after hearing Parchaar of Baba Ji, and they now actively (and successfully with Guru Ji's Kirpaa) do Parchaar. Even though they sing Dhaarnas, they join Sangat with Bani and they each keep Rehit of Bani/Bana.

Of Bhai Sahib Bhai Randhir Singh Ji's meeting with Sant Attar Singh Ji, I understand the following took place in relation to Sant Attar Singh Ji singing Dhaarnas: Bhai Sahib Ji asked Sant Ji why he sings Dhaarna and wouldn't it be better if he sang Gurbani? Sant Ji replied that his duty from Guru Ji is only to lay the seed of Sikhi inspiration within everyday Punjabi folk, so that they start reading Bani and keeping Rehit. Sant Ji said that Guru Ji had bestowed the duty on Bhai Sahib Ji of making these people "Pukkae" Rehitvaan Jeevan-vale Gursikhs. At this exchange, both Gursikhs parted company. Despite, perhaps, this little difference in veechar, both had immense respect for each other's Jeevan, Kamaiye and Abhiyaas, and they both continued to do Sangat of each other.

This is very different to today's world, where when Gursikhs find one minor issue they disagree with each other, they begin to criticise and condemn other Gursikhs. Whilst acknowledging minor differences, we should rise above this and recognise the common binding force for all Gursikhs, which is Guru Granth Sahib Ji and our Khalsa Brotherhood. Only through unity will our Panth continue to progress.
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Re: Dhaarna
June 28, 2011 11:18AM
WJKK,WJKF,KHALSA JI, GURMAKH PIARE NO NEACH MOORAKH JI and KHALSA JIO dass not critisised anybody but dass want to know vichar of gurmukh piare jan.One gurmukh came newly blessed by khande di pahul.He asked that his mann was to blessed by amrit from those punj piare in which one of the panth very famous sant doing sewa as punj.And he went a dera near patiala to took amrit.This was not good but dass requested him to explained about amrit sanchar smagam.He said that their was 946 pranni to take amrit.Amrit sanchar start at 9.00pm and finished at 2.00am.Dass was surprised that how fast this amrit sanchar smagam was held.Dass only shared this incident to know from many of those gursikh which gave there costly vichaar on this forum that in 5 hours by what kind of maryada follow by punj singh sahiban to blessed 946 pranni by amrit. bhag heen bhram chotan khave
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Re: Dhaarna
June 28, 2011 12:36PM
Bhag Heen Brother/Sister - it seems to me you're clearly referring to Baba Ranjit Singh Ji in your post. If you're from the UK, Baba Ji will be coming here next month. Why don't you ask them your question in person, and respond with your answers here? From personal experience, they are very approachable and will be willing to listen to and answer any questions you may have. Rather than have any misunderstandings created/further promulgated over the internet, it's best to resolve these "shankae" in person. If you disagree with the responses, that's fine but I'm sure you'll have a better understanding of why there may be certain differences.

It's widely accepted that Akhand Kirtani Jatha may disagree on certain points with "Dhaarna-wale Babae", though all Gursikhs are trying to serve their Guru Ji faithfully with Prem and Bhaavnaa. Let's not let these minor differences cause splits amongst us. In fact, there are many Akhand Kirtani Jatha Singhs today in India and the UK (that I'm aware of) that show respect and do Sangat with Nirvair Khalsa Jatha Singhs. Let's continue to aim to build the mutual love and respect that Gursikhs had in olden days across all Sampardaas and Jathebandis. smiling smiley
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Re: Dhaarna
June 28, 2011 01:59PM
WJKK,WJKF,BHAI GURMUKH PIARE JIO,Dass was not creating misunderstanding.And dass was very surprise by knowing this that AKJ gursikhs doing sangat of nirvair khalsa jatha in india and uk.

sathiguroo binaa hor kachee hai baanee ||
baanee th kachee sathiguroo baajhahu hor kachee baanee ||
kehadhae kachae sunadhae kachae kacha(n)aee aakh vakhaanee ||
har har nith karehi rasanaa kehiaa kashhoo n jaanee ||
chith jin kaa hir laeiaa maaeiaa bolan peae ravaanee ||
kehai naanak sathiguroo baajhahu hor kachee baanee ||24
bhag heen bhram chotan khave
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Re: Dhaarna
June 28, 2011 02:14PM
Waheguru Je Ka Khalsa Waheguru Je Ke Fateh

No problem with dharan if it's having an impact keep at it-- or any other styleee but begging question reamins as below to all:::

Guru Sahibhan designed beautiful insruments such as rebaab,saranda to sing kirtan from in raag, however we design our own tools such as dharan - and filimi tunes for kirtan. Why is it that we sikhs are brillant at reinventing the wheel but not take pride in keeping traditions is beyone me.?
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Re: Dhaarna
June 28, 2011 02:24PM
Just some personal thoughts:

Satguroo Siri Guru Nanak Dev jee Maharaj could have recited folklore lyrics/songs to people and taught them about the Truth through this way, but He instead chose Gurbaani, through the use of music. Whenever Gurbani would descend from Sachkhand Sahib, Siri Guru Jee would instruct Bhai Mardana jee to play the rabaab and from there, Guru jee would carry on. Siri Guru jee had the ability to still pierce people's hearts through use of Kachi Baani, because if still him singing, and therefore although it might have been kachi, Guru jee's voice, presence, and everything about Him would've touched everyone. But Guru Sahib sang Gurbani instead. Guru Sahib could've even sung compositions from various known writings of that time, but He sang the True Baani, Gurbaani. The Kalaa (which can be best described as "effect" in English, according to me) could only take place through Gurbaani.

Another point that I think is worth mentioning is that, when Satguru Guru Gobind Singh jee held the sword in His Hand, and asked for a volunteer to give his head for the sake of the Guru and Panth, the first one to get up was Dharam Das, who was later named Dharam Singh. Keep in mind that there was a crowd of about 40 000 people. Had Guru Sahib jee uttered Gurbaani, maybe the effect would have been different.

Bhulan Chukan di khima bakhshni
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Re: Dhaarna
June 28, 2011 03:35PM
Pyarai Bhai Jaspreet Singh jeeo maybe i am mistaken but was it not Bhai Daya Singh the first to offer their head?
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Re: Dhaarna
June 28, 2011 03:57PM
VAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA, VAHEGURU JI KI FATEH

At some point, to keep the respect and love for each other, different Jathebandis should respectfully agree to disagree on these points. Bhai Sahib and Baba Ji did so, as we should take this as an example. Otherwise, it would be very easy to highlight differences for any group against another. Taking the example above, Guru Sahib also wrote Gurbani in Raags, which are not always utilized in AKJ programs - something that individuals take shots against the Jatha with.

Take the good from each thing and leave what you don't agree with, because within the garden of Sikhi, there are a lot of flowers. The gardener loves each one, but also loves variety. It is of no use for the rose to critique the lilly, or for the lilly to cast doubt on the tulip.
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Re: Dhaarna
June 29, 2011 11:21AM
VAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA, VAHEGURU JI KI FATEH


beautifully said MS514 jee wah!!!
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