Effects of doing parchar to non-gursikhs

Sadh Sangat jeeo, Vaheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Vaheguru Ji Ki Fateh

Recently daas has been spending time in sangat which I would not normally be in, as generally I like to be around Gursikhs as I am such a neech individual I need that around me to keep me on track as my mind is VERY susceptible to what is around me. The thing is in my university I am one of only a very few amritdharis, we have been having quite a few events lately as part of the sikh society, however although all those who come are very good people, most are not particularly very religious otherwise and not in a bad way but quite a bit of behaviour is exhibited which is not even particularly wrong but it is distracting for someone trying to meet Vaheguru Sahib. I find that in placing my self right in the centre of sangat which I would not normally be in, my mind is being GREATLY effected. I am feeling a lot of vikaars in my mind and my thoughts are becoming similar to those around me, i.e. emphasis in mind is no longer on naam and bani and buliding hardcore jeevan, which is what it is when around the pyare pyare hardcore singhs. The thing is I don't feel I can distance myself from the sikh society as I feel obliged as one of the few amritdharis to represent the roop and spread Guru Sahib's message. Perhaps it is hankaar, but i know there is also truth in it that if daas was not there there would be a lack in the parchar there and also some non-gurmat would be spread as well. This is why I feel in a very difficult situation, how can I stay in the center of this sangat, having to actively socialise a lot with non-gursikhs (and i mean that in the nicest way possible), while preserving what little sikh of my own there is? Also you have to do a bit of 'chit chat' to make those with little involvement in sikhi to feel comfortable and willing to listen and show you are not a fanatic, how have others balanced this to make sure they are not losing they're own sikhi in the process? thanks

ਮੁਖ ਕੀ ਬਾਤ ਸਗਲ ਸਿਉ ਕਰਤਾ ॥
mukh kee baath sagal sio karathaa ||
By word of mouth, I talk with everyone;
ਜੀਅ ਸੰਗਿ ਪ੍ਰਭੁ ਅਪੁਨਾ ਧਰਤਾ ॥੨॥
jeea sang prabh apunaa dhharathaa ||2||
but I keep God clasped to my heart. ||2||

You are very fortunate to have a strong desire for Guru Sahibs darshan; Guru Sahib says those who want my darshan are very blessed. So you should make efforts to keep this blessing. If we want to get closer to Guru Sahibs light we should socialize with those who are also making efforts to get closer to Guru Sahibs light or who are already close to Guru Sahibs light. If we hang around with those who are ignorantly and purposely lost in the dark then that shadow will eventually hover over our minds.

You should avoid those that have no intention for Gursikh unless you are a hardecore Sojhivan Singh like Bhai Randhir SIngh JI, Baba Isher SIngh JI, Baba Nand Singh Ji Baba Attar Singh Ji etc who was so much into Guru Sahibs light that their illuminated presence attracted even those lost in the dark. Even those Bibekee Singhs started from somwhere. They were strict in practicing Bibek they did not just hang out with anyone at their initial spiritual stage; instead they mainly kept sangat of Gurmukh Singhs who were serious seekers. Because of the sadh sangat they became the type of Singhs that we all look up too. They become role model singhs.

I had this conversation about socializing with niguras with a few singhs a couple of months ago. They were mentioning to me that sometimes we have to adapt we might have to watch a movie or play video games to attract people into Sikhi. I said no way can a Singh effect his own jeevan just to convert another person. We are not a proselytizing faith, we are not Christians or Muslims. Our goal is not to convert people even if they were born into Sikh backgrounds. Instead our goal is to get close to Guru Sahib and have sangat with those who " want to" get close to Guru Sahib. These Singhs got so upset with my strict beliefs that they walked out the room, and tryed to make me feel like a fanatic. No doubt if you stop going to the " Sikh Society" people will call you an inflexible fanatic, but we not let these labels deter us from our divine destiny.

[www.sikhitothemax.com]

you don't have to avoid non-sikhs. you just have to remain detached so you don't get pulled into their manmukh ways.



ਜੈਤਸਰੀ ਮਹਲਾ ੫ ॥
Jaitsree, Fifth Mehl:

ਜਾ ਕਉ ਭਏ ਗੋਵਿੰਦ ਸਹਾਈ ॥
One who has the Lord of the Universe as his help and support

ਸੂਖ ਸਹਜ ਆਨੰਦ ਸਗਲ ਸਿਉ ਵਾ ਕਉ ਬਿਆਧਿ ਨ ਕਾਈ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
is blessed with all peace, poise and bliss; no afflictions cling to him. ||1||Pause||

ਦੀਸਹਿ ਸਭ ਸੰਗਿ ਰਹਹਿ ਅਲੇਪਾ ਨਹ ਵਿਆਪੈ ਉਨ ਮਾਈ ॥
He appears to keep company with everyone, but he remains detached, and Maya does not cling to him.

ਏਕੈ ਰੰਗਿ ਤਤ ਕੇ ਬੇਤੇ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਤੇ ਬੁਧਿ ਪਾਈ ॥੧॥
He is absorbed in love of the One Lord; he understands the essence of reality, and he is blessed with wisdom by the True Guru. ||1||

ਦਇਆ ਮਇਆ ਕਿਰਪਾ ਠਾਕੁਰ ਕੀ ਸੇਈ ਸੰਤ ਸੁਭਾਈ ॥
Those whom the Lord and Master blesses with His kindness, compassion and mercy are the sublime and sanctified Saints.

ਤਿਨ ਕੈ ਸੰਗਿ ਨਾਨਕ ਨਿਸਤਰੀਐ ਜਿਨ ਰਸਿ ਰਸਿ ਹਰਿ ਗੁਨ ਗਾਈ ॥੨॥੩॥੭॥
Associating with them, Nanak is saved; with love and exuberant joy, they sing the Glorious Praises of the Lord. ||2||3||7||

ਕਬੀਰ ਮਾਰੀ ਮਰਉ ਕੁਸੰਗ ਕੀ ਕੇਲੇ ਨਿਕਟਿ ਜੁ ਬੇਰਿ ॥

Kabeer, I have been ruined and destroyed by bad company, like the banana plant near the thorn bush.

the previous pangti mentioned in favor of socializing with Niguras

ਦੀਸਹਿ ਸਭ ਸੰਗਿ ਰਹਹਿ ਅਲੇਪਾ ਨਹ ਵਿਆਪੈ ਉਨ ਮਾਈ ॥

it appears the pangti has been mistranslated as

" He appears to keep company with everyone, but he remains detached, and Maya does not cling to him"

This translation does not make sense in all practical matters.

The meanings should be more like
remaining detached, maya has no effect on him; everyone appears them same to him.

Meaning he sees no high or low, poor or rich, etc. He has no attachments to friends and family. Because he is not effected by maya ( dual mindedness) everyone seems the same to him he treats even a stranger no different to the he would treat his own mother which is in line with Gurmat Maryada.

It is not part of Gurmat Bibek Maryada to be so clumsy as to socialize with any John Doe who has no desire for WaaheGurus darshan. What would be the purpose of such socializing? Just because we dont socialize with people it doesnt mean we think bad about them or think they are evil. We just feel as though it as a spiritual hindrance in getting into a non dualistic state in which we see Gurus light illuminating everywhere.

ਦੀਸਹਿ ਸਭ ਸੰਗਿ ਰਹਹਿ ਅਲੇਪਾ ਨਹ ਵਿਆਪੈ ਉਨ ਮਾਈ ॥

This is a great pangti which brings many spiritual jewels. To get a better understanding of this I would recommend reading Bhai Daya Singh Jis original rehatnama.

LOL alot of amritdari sikhs have been extremely rude/horrible to me and I am an amritdari sikh myself. Where as many many many AND many non sikhs have been very good to me.

So tell me now?! Why think just because a person is a non sikh, they aren't good enough to be around ??......

ਜਨੁ ਨਾਨਕੁ ਧੂੜਿ ਮੰਗੈ ਤਿਸੁ ਗੁਰਸਿਖ ਕੀ ਜੋ ਆਪਿ ਜਪੈ ਅਵਰਹ ਨਾਮੁ ਜਪਾਵੈ ॥੨॥
Servant Nanak begs for the dust of the feet of that GurSikh, who himself chants the Naam, and inspires others to chant it. ||2||

Leafy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> LOL alot of amritdari sikhs have been extremely
> rude/horrible to me and I am an amritdari sikh
> myself. Where as many many many AND many non sikhs
> have been very good to me.
>
> So tell me now?! Why think just because a person
> is a non sikh, they aren't good enough to be
> around ??......


I never mentioned anything about just hanging around with any amritdhari. I specifically said if you want a spiritual life you should socialize with spiritual beings. Spiritual beings meaning Gurmukhs or those trying to be Gurmukhs. Its real simple lets not make it so complicated.

ਜਨੁ ਨਾਨਕੁ ਧੂੜਿ ਮੰਗੈ ਤਿਸੁ ਗੁਰਸਿਖ ਕੀ ਜੋ ਆਪਿ ਜਪੈ ਅਵਰਹ ਨਾਮੁ ਜਪਾਵੈ ॥੨॥

Guru Sahib says he wants the dust of those GuruSikhs who do Naam Abhyiaas and have others do Naam Abhyiaas in the Sadh Sangat.

okay then you can't call a person who does kirtan in sangat and they're baptised sikhs and then swear at other bapstised sikhs for no reason, or are these people gurmukhs too? i don't know, so enlighten me...

Feeling uncomfortable "amongst non-gursikhs" is but natural for a gursikh, but it does not mean that we are supposed to get delinked with them. With all those reservations of "BIBEK" imposed on us and our honest committment to adhere with those; why we are supposed to not even chat with the humanity?

It is totally impractical and irrational to consider every other person as a hindrance to "Gursikh Jeewan"?

As a "Head of the Institution" I am supposed to meet every employee and guest of my institute. As a student, I need help of my fellows. As a business man, I need to make relations with my customers. As a physician, I am supposed to treat every patient. As I a son, I am supposed to visit hindu relatives of my mother.

It is really difficult to live without SANGAT, but it is equally difficult to live without SOCIETY.

It is the delicate equilibrium, which is supposed to be achieved, I think. NAAM AND DIETRY BIBEK help in it.

Quote
MB SINGH
It is totally impractical and irrational to consider every other person as a hindrance to "Gursikh Jeewan"?

Totally right.

My personal experience when I used to be a mona was that in the sangat of only Muslim friends, I would be a lot more dedicated towards doing my Nitnem when I saw them extremely dedicated to doing their 5 Namaaz daily.

I work at a school and so there is constant interaction where I work. However, I treat everyone with an equal eye. Whether the person is the janitor or school principal I still communicate with both parties in a friendly and productive manner. I dont act like a chamcha and over socialize with those in higher ranks for the sake of a promotion. There is a big difference between socializing and communicating. Socializng is when we start to act, and think like others. At my work people respect my beliefs and dont expect me to assimilate and act like them. Like Mehtab Singh Ji has mentioned there is no harm in talking or even socializing with Dharmic people that encourage you to follow your own faith. At my work I have had many friendly conversations with those beloning to other faiths and I have learned some things from them in the process.

I hope the sangat will allow my lowly views on this topic.

I believe that we should avoid unnecessary association with everyone except Gursikhs. The key word being unnecessary, obviously in our daily lives grist jeevan, we have to speak and spend time with colleagues, classmates, shopkeepers etc but we should only do that as much as we have to, to live in the society. If we are just chatting for the sake of chatting, then that is not acceptable. The Gursikhs have nothing but love for everyone, they don't see people as hindrances, they are hoping for opportunities to help and serve people. The only hindrance in Gursikhi Jeevan is our chanchal and chatraee (fickle and crafty) mind. If there is a Gursikh who is doing full power naam khanda every morning it is not going to bother them even a little bit to have friendly conversations with classmates and work colleagues whilst going about their daily business.

For example if someone is visiting relatives house and they are not Gursikhs we can do the expected friendly greetings, how are you, how is school, work etc but if things start going too far e.g. bollywood movies or other peoples affairs we must make strict stance on this and not allow ourselves to become involved even if we may upset near and dear ones by doing so. I think when a normal person even has a conversation with a Gursikh they should instinctively be able to tell just from their appearance and mannerisms what this person will like to talk about and what they won't.

In the case of Theguptone jee's original post about the Sikh Society, if one is just oozing in Gurmukhi pyaar and staying engrossed in naam abhiyaas one will automatically be able to attract those who may be interested in Sikhi from those who just come to eat samosas, and thereby getting an opportunity to do Gurmat parchaar.

Begging forgiveness for all mistakes.

VAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA, VAHEGURU JI KI FATEH

There is worldly associations and there is Sangat. Worldly associations and dealing with different individuals in society is part of life. We all work, we all have bills to pay and we all have worldly things like businesses, shopping, and whatnot that will put us in contact with non Sikhs.

This Shabad seems to exemplify the ideals for a Sikh's interaction with the world:

ਸਾਚਿ ਨਾਮਿ ਮੇਰਾ ਮਨੁ ਲਾਗਾ ॥
saach naam maeraa man laagaa ||
My mind is attached to the True Name.

ਲੋਗਨ ਸਿਉ ਮੇਰਾ ਠਾਠਾ ਬਾਗਾ ॥੧॥
logan sio maeraa thaathaa baagaa ||1||
My dealings with other people are only superficial. ||1||

ਬਾਹਰਿ ਸੂਤੁ ਸਗਲ ਸਿਉ ਮਉਲਾ ॥
baahar sooth sagal sio moulaa ||
Outwardly, I am on good terms with all;

ਅਲਿਪਤੁ ਰਹਉ ਜੈਸੇ ਜਲ ਮਹਿ ਕਉਲਾ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
alipath reho jaisae jal mehi koulaa ||1|| rehaao ||
but I remain detached, like the lotus upon the water. ||1||Pause||

ਮੁਖ ਕੀ ਬਾਤ ਸਗਲ ਸਿਉ ਕਰਤਾ ॥
mukh kee baath sagal sio karathaa ||
By word of mouth, I talk with everyone;

ਜੀਅ ਸੰਗਿ ਪ੍ਰਭੁ ਅਪੁਨਾ ਧਰਤਾ ॥੨॥
jeea sang prabh apunaa dhharathaa ||2||
but I keep God clasped to my heart. ||2||

ਦੀਸਿ ਆਵਤ ਹੈ ਬਹੁਤੁ ਭੀਹਾਲਾ ॥
dhees aavath hai bahuth bheehaalaa ||
I may appear utterly terrible,

ਸਗਲ ਚਰਨ ਕੀ ਇਹੁ ਮਨੁ ਰਾਲਾ ॥੩॥
sagal charan kee eihu man raalaa ||3||
but my mind is the dust of all men's feet.

ਨਾਨਕ ਜਨਿ ਗੁਰੁ ਪੂਰਾ ਪਾਇਆ ॥
naanak jan gur pooraa paaeiaa ||
Servant Nanak has found the Perfect Guru.

So the Gursikh will have superficial dealings with the people of the world, as we are charged with being householders and do not shun society but live in it and serve it as well. But the mind is to be concentrating on the Almighty at all times (Naam, Gurbani). To facilitate that Naam and Gurbani, one would seek deep, meaningful relations with fellow Sikhs. So deep, meaningful relationships (roti beti di sanjh) is with Sikhs, but Guru Sahib has also shown the path for worldly interactions.

It is an entirely different situation when a non Sikh decides to keep Sangat of Sikhs - such should be nurtured, encouraged and fostered, as there is a spark there which desires to become a Gursikh. But attempting to go into a crowd of non Sikhs and doing parchar of Sikhi is very difficult. Unless the condition of Mun Jeetae Jug Jeet has been fulfilled, it will be very difficult to not be influenced by non Sikh behaviors. I am often reminded of a talk with my father about the parchar of Sikhi in the centuries before. There were no books or Dharam Parchar committee - it was the character of a Sikh that attracted people to the Gursikh. They exemplified a good spiritual life and ignited the spirit of non Sikhs around them. Even the enemies spoke praises of Gursikhs.

Wah, thanks, Veer Sukhdeep Singh Ji, for making the concept very clear. Socializing is different from communicating.

What a great post from Bhai ms514 jee! Thanks a lot, there is always a lot to learn. What an appropriate shabad you have posted as well