Pesticides for Insects - Gurmat view?

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa,
Waheguru ji Ki Fateh!

It is quite common in a household to have mosquitoes, cockroaches, rats and other insects.
In order to rid them, one needs to use various ways for eradicating them.
Please note that sometimes you DO NOT have an effective repellents. Hence you are left with no choice than to use a powerful alternative to kill them.

Just want to know the Gurmat view of the same?

One one hand, they also have life; however from practicability perspective, you have to take these measures of eradicating them.
We are also told not to act like Jainis (like cleaning the path in front of you while walking, lest you step on some insect, covering mouth, etc), but live in a practical manner in Sikhi. But on the other hand, won't such acts become 'karam'?

What is your opinion on this, please?

Dass,
-JP

maybe it's the insects' karam to be killed upon entering your home?

these pests carry disease. they are an enemy to our health. what if some insect bites a gurmukh in your home and that gurmukh becomes gravely ill.
to kill an enemy to preserve the health and wellbeing of the sangat can't be so wrong, can it?

my practice:

use non-lethal means whenever possible. a line of paprika around doors and windows will keep ants from entering your home, without need of harsh chemicals (which can be more dangerous than the pests they prevent!) but if you accidentally slap a mosquito, look at it this way. maybe you've saved someone from malaria with that small act of violence. besides, you're just speeding their way onto a new joon, hopefully one better than an insect! i try not to kill beneficial insects (bees, spiders, etc), but will let them outside the door. but disease carrying pests... all bets are off.


(this thread reminds me of my nephew in amritsar, carefully catching rats from the kitchen in a non-lethal trap, then running away from the local dogs to release the rat where it won't be eaten.)

in daas's houses we had gotten bed bugs for some reason. and every night they would bite me and for months i was very very very very itchyy all the time, i did not want to kill them, but finally something had to be done, i felt bad that they were being killed, but they were really messing up my life. even when i would read some bani i would be sooo itchy i wouldn't be able to concentrate on bani.

so i think perhaps the bugs did get some good karma to at least enter a house that has bani read in it, like yours jpsingh77

oddslot

Thanks '1Kaur' bhein Ji & 'gsingh' Veer Ji for your kind inputs and comments!

Both the comments have been in the favour of eradicating the insects.

What does the gurmat say about it, though? Doesn't Sacche Patshah Guru Gobind Singh Ji says - "Chinti Te Kunchar Asthoola - Subh Pur Kirpa Drisht Kar Phoola". Will Akal Purakh condone this? I'm abit confused here...!

when some soul gets joon of a harmful insect, it's only because of his actions in the past. when someone slaps that insect, that's the karam of both insect and human. do you think we have control over all of it?
everything is the play of waheguru.

over-thinking these things can't be beneficial. if you feel bad about it, do ardaas for the soul of the insect so they may get a better joon. do simran as you apply the pesticide. is pesticide gurmat? how can anyone answer that. but the ardaas for the soul is, the sirman you do as you spray is....

sikhi is not a rule book like christianity or islam. there's not a list of "do this don't do that". the list of "do" starts and ends with naam. why do we worry so much about the small small things? do you think guru sahib sat wondering whether he should slap a mosquito as it was biting him? my guess is he was probably so engrossed in naam that he didn't care about the mosquito at all.

these pests carry disease. they are an enemy to our health. what if some insect bites a gurmukh in your home and that gurmukh becomes gravely ill.

Well i dont very well agree to the theory above. Once i was with someone eating NOn-VEG and the conversation start to EAT/NOT EAT and he replied

"We eat this so as to preserve the HUMANs from these animals. If we dont eat these animals they will be too much on earth on one day and that will be NO good to the Humans".

My answer was - Well then start eating humans too as the population is also increaing rapidly. (At least start that for now in ASIAN countries)


I also think there is no more deadly animal than a human (if he loose his senses) - we have seen the destruction caused by humans in the past and quite recently too.

Bhul Chuk Maaf !!

I think Best think to do Gurmukh is to keep the house clean. I know these come only if you keep the house dirty. Kicthen/toilets all need to be very well cleaned and that would surely avoid insects in the house.These insects are found on DERBIS,garbagge and non-clean places. So keep the houses clean and they wont come



if you feel bad about it, do ardaas for the soul of the insect so they may get a better joon. do simran as you apply the pesticide. is pesticide gurmat? how can anyone answer that. but the ardaas for the soul is, the sirman you do as you spray is....

The above suggestion is commentable as well. That would mean do Ardass and keep killing anything ??? I think these insects are also the UPPJ of akalpurakh and they are here with his Hukam and have the right to survive as well just like the Humans. Why would human think that he has the right to kill these to keep his house clean ?? How abt if the Lion comes to our house and he feels that Human is dangerous to him and he stars killing us :)

Bhul Chuk Maaf !!

my point was only that we kill enemies of the panth in battle, why are we afraid to kill a disease ridden insect which is also our enemy?

it's not the same as killing for food... that comparison you made is completely illogical

I think its the same thing you kill for food or for keeping the house clean - after all its for your personal benefits/use and i dont agree to taking a life for any personal benefits.

Better option would be keep the houses clean.

Bhul Chuk Maaf !!

veerjee, please forgive my poor english.

i guess my point is, we're not jains.

Firstly, I would just like to say I am not intending to offend or specially direct these comments at anyone in particular, if I do offend I beg for your forgiveness.

Now, I would just like to say, some of the questions that are being asked on these finer points, including by this moorakh as well (Unintentional Kesh beadbi, size of Kakkars, certain ingredients in foods/products etc) if you ask this to elderly Gurmukhs especially in India, they will just laugh merrily and say "Singhaa aihai je cheeja vaare ni phikar karde" "The Singhs don't even worry about these type of things".

I have noticed the Singhs in India have a lot more of a rough and tough approach to following Gurmat than we do with the nitty gritty (splitting hairs) in the West, maybe this is something we can learn from. Just recently, few months ago, a famous elderly Singh in the AKJ who sometimes does Punj Pyaare seva, and is widely loved and respected, showed me a bottle of Vitamin/Supplement type things and asked me what it was, I replied to them and also mentioned that it contained Beef Gelatin and explained that is was made from the crushed bones of animals, or whatever it is. They understood what I was trying to say. Anyway, later I noticed they took them anyway lol! I'm not saying we should do this, but maybe take something from it.

Everything we do is incurring karams, we kill millions/billions bacteria doing Ishnaan, cleaning the house etc, while walking we may step on bugs or inhale a fly or something, but the Gurmukhs don't even worry about this stuff, they just do what they have to do and stay engaged in Naam Abhiyaas eventually becoming karam-free.

Khalsa shouldn't be afraid to kill another person if absolute necessary why is Khalsa questioning whether to kill an insect? Sorry, it came across as very humorous to me.

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Khalsa shouldn't be afraid to kill another person if absolute necessary why is Khalsa questioning whether to kill an insect? Sorry, it came across as very humorous to me.

Veer Ji, please do not relate the two things. Enemies and insects are not similar. Even enemies are killed, when all other means to win them over have failed. Harmful insects are to be repelled first. Only when it is absolutely necessary, we can dare to kill them. Compassion is part and parcel of a spiritual being. Spirituality (DHARAM) follows compassion (DAYA).

Waheguru.

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I think Best think to do Gurmukh is to keep the house clean. I know these come only if you keep the house dirty. Kicthen/toilets all need to be very well cleaned and that would surely avoid insects in the house.These insects are found on DERBIS,garbagge and non-clean places. So keep the houses clean and they wont come

not gurmat,, but just a comment on the above...


i believe you are confused about the lifecycles of various insects. SOME insects (flies, for example) are attracted to filth. others (mosquitos for example) are attracted to human blood and breed in standing water. ants will come for stored food in the cleanest of houses. spiders and small lizards will come anywhere there may be food insects. the idea that insect infestation can be prevented with simple housekeeping is incorrect.

example: i am moving from my house and have it ready for sale. it is immaculately clean, everything is packed in sealed boxes in the garage. there's barely any food in the house at all and what there is is sealed tightly and shut in cabinets. every surface was washed and scrubbed and there's not a single crumb of food or dirty utensil anywhere. i left the house in this condition for two weeks to facilitate my move. when i returned, there were small black bugs called "pill bug" scattered dead across my tile floor. it seems they come into the house for cooler temperature, and due to lack of water they die. on the night i arrived home, crickets were swarming everywhere in my town. they come towards light, so when i opened my house door many of them came rushing towards the cool of the house and the light inside. again, not finding food or water, they quickly die. but none of these things has to do with filth or dirt.

again, not particularly on topic, but i think it's important that we understand that all insects/animals are different and may enter our homes for different reasons. it's a common theory that if we just keep things clean the insects will go away, but that's simply untrue. we try to oversimplify everything in order to make easy solutions, but life is more complicated. waheguru has made millions of lifeforms and every single one of them is different. we cannot paint them all with the same brush.

anyway, sorry to comment off topic, just trying to educated a bit on a pet peeve topic of mine.