Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 20, 2014 06:45AM |
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We already have our own nation its called Khalsa. The concept Raj Karega Khalsa was first pronounced to Ruka Din in Saudi Arabia. It had nothing to do with a Sikh Political State in Punjab; Raj Karega Khalsa was referring to spiritual kingdom of SIkhi which will extend to all four corners of the world. Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji came into this world and laid the foundation stone of a spirutual kingdom. A kingdom where one had access to Godly kingdom (sach khand) while living active this world while practicing Gurmat qualities
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Us Sikhs have forgotten about this kingdom because we are too busy crying about a political kingdom as if such a kingdom is the solution to all our problems.
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Sikhs have always faced disrcimination, atrocities, injustices and they never proposed having a poltical state to stop such actions. Sikhi strives in adversity.
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 20, 2014 08:43AM |
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 20, 2014 08:52AM |
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 20, 2014 09:13AM |
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 20, 2014 09:24AM |
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 20, 2014 11:29AM |
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 20, 2014 11:37AM |
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Secondly, Sikhi has always strived without their own state. They did so during the Gurus time and much after. Guru Sahib never proposed a SIkh state which would marginalize Sikhs from the global world. Gurumukhs including Sant Jarnail SIngh never really proposed a religious state
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 20, 2014 11:56AM |
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 20, 2014 01:33PM |
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 20, 2014 02:23PM |
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But please look at the verb "Karega". This is a verb denoting a future event. The spiritual kingdom of Guru Sahib has been there ever since this universe came into being. As for the spiritual kingdom of Khalsa, that happened as soon as first few Khalsa very formed by Siri Guru Nanak Dev jee. Therefore, this Dohra is definitely talking about the political Khalsa nation.
Please ponder upon the Dohra again:
Raag karega Khalsa, Aaki rahe na koe.
Khuaar huye sabh milenge, bache sharan jo hoe.
The verb "karega" and "milenge" clealry show that this is a future event that had not taken place even till the time of Siri Gobind Singh jee because if it had, then there was no need to read this Dohra. All this talk of having a spiritual kingdom and not a political state is ghaala-maala and a way to put our quom in Bhambalbhoosa (don't know the English for this word). When straightforward meaning of the Dohra is apparent, then what's the need to do such complicated meaning as you are doing?
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No one is saying that having such political kingdom is the solution to all our problems. I can't understand, how Hindu rule or a Muslim rule on us can be better than self rule.
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This is such a naive statement. Pyare veer, as recently as 20 - 30 years ago, tens of thousands of Sikhs attained Shaheedi with "Khalistan" on their mouths and minds. It's one thing that we are not doing any effort to get Khalsa Raj but to oppose a political Sikh nation is "Ghadaari" to thousands of Sikhs who died for this cause. Don't take this comment personal but I have no hesitation in saying that any Sikh who opposes Khalsa Raj is a Ghadaar (traitor) of Khalsa Panth and Siri Guru Dasmesh jee will severely punish such Sikh and such Sikh will be denied Mukti (100 percent). How can you forget our Shaheeds? I believe any Sikh who goes against Panth and against Khalsa Raj is a Tankhaaiya.
All Mahapurakhs have predicted Khalsa Raj including Bhai Sahib Randhir Singh jee. If Khalsa Raj is already there, as you have stated, then what Raj are our Mahapurakhs predicting? I am not sure if you have done active work in opposing Khalsa Raj but if you have, you should get Tankhah from Sangat or Punj Pyare for doing so.
Fine, we are not doing any effort for Khalsa Raj, but at the very least, let's not opposed it either. Guru Sahib ne kadi muaaf nahi karna.
Kulbir Singh
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 20, 2014 05:30PM |
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 20, 2014 10:39PM |
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 21, 2014 02:18AM |
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 21, 2014 02:26AM |
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 21, 2014 02:09PM |
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Sukhdeep Singh, Bhai Kulbir Singh was not talking about Ghadris, but Ghadaars (traitors). Guru Sahib has mentioned that the Khalsa will rule. Khalsa will rule Rome, Kabul, Ghazni, Mecca, Medina. The throne of this Kingdom will be at Delhi. I fully agree with Kulbir Singh, anyone that opposes Khalsa Raj is a traitor Ghadaar (not Ghadri.), such person will be punished severely by Guru Sahib. You do not have faith in Guru Sahib that he will make Khalsa Raj?
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 22, 2014 07:18AM |
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I have been around drug dealers, gang bangers, hustlers and heard some harsh comments directed towards me, but these harsh words cant compare even an iota to the bitter words you and Kulbir SIngh has said too me. You honestly think because I dont share your political views on Punajb I wont get mukhti.
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 22, 2014 02:29PM |
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I myself was pained when I wrote to you those words that hurt your feelings but you are thinking about only your own hurt feelings and are totally oblivious of how we all felt when our own brother, a rehitvaan Gursikh, came about in public and openly opposed one of the most sacred beliefs of Gurmat. Of course I understand the difference between Khalistan and the predicted Khalsa Raj but you fail to understand that by opposing self government for Sikhs, you have ignored the sacrifices of countless Sikhs in the post 1947 period. I think you need to read the history of Sikhs in the post 1947 era. A person who goes against Panth Khalsa gets Tankhah from Panth. Refer to the Saakhi of Bhai Subegh Singh and Bhai Shahbaaz Singh, who were employed by the Lahore Darbar and whenever they came to the congregation of Khalsa, before anything, they used to get Tankhah for working for the government when Khalsa was fighting the government of that time. Same way, today, you should not oppose the political aspirations of living Sikhs and hundreds of thousands who got Shaheed. Neither you, nor me, and nor others are doing anything politically but at the same time, we should oppose the concept of political independence of Sikhs and that too based on what you learned in the parochial political science class studied in USA. The Sikh political aspirations are not governed by the academic institutions of USA, Europe, Russia or India but are governed by the Baaghi-or-Baadshah concept of Puratan Sikhs.
I feel bad for hurting your feelings but can't take my comments about not getting Mukti or being a Tankhaiya back because that would by lying and I truly believe that a Sikh who opposes the aspirations of true Gurmukh Pyare collectively and works against the independence of Khalsa Panth is treading a very dangerous path that goes in the direction opposite of Sikhi. Such misled Sikh should seek forgiveness from Sangat so that this bad Karma of opposing the independence of Khalsa Panth does not harm his spirituality, Sikhi and afterlife.
There is nothing personal against you dear Veer Sukhdeep Singh. Tainu samjha rahe haan ke Panth de ult na jaa. Baaki teri marzi hai bhai.
Kulbir Singh
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 22, 2014 04:18PM |
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 22, 2014 06:09PM |
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When some Akali Politicians proposed a three state solution in Hindustan based on British chalking, a state very similar to the concept of a Khalistan, Bhai Sahib Bhai Randhir Singh Ji strongly opposed this proposition. The simple reason being, it was not beneficial for that day and time nor did this modern nation state support the ideals of Sikhi. Now the majority of Sikhs were for such a state but Bhai Sahib wasnt.
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Is he a tankhiya for opposing Jhatka at at time when majority Sikhs strongly supported it? Is he a tankhaiya for progagating Keski as kakkar when majority of panth state Kes is a kakkar?
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In the 80's Khalistan was rightfully promulgated as a defiant stance against the Indian regime for the injustices. Today 2014, we live in a different reality. Situation is compleltely different in Punjab. Sikhs are completelly different in Punajb. Different circumstances cause for different solutions. The most obvious being taken control over our religious instiutions. A Khalistan is not practical . How many times do I need to remind you, Sikhs are not a majority in Punjab, nor are they interested in living in a theocracy.
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 22, 2014 07:52PM |
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 22, 2014 09:17PM |
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 22, 2014 10:39PM |
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 22, 2014 11:36PM |
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 23, 2014 05:52PM |
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nor are they interested in living in a theocracy.
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 23, 2014 09:47PM |
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 24, 2014 07:37PM |
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 25, 2014 03:14AM |
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 25, 2014 05:57AM |
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 30, 2014 05:06PM |
Re: Can women be Panj Pyare? October 31, 2014 12:01PM |