Langar/Parshada kirpan bhet (bhog) @ home

vaheguru ji ka khalsa vaheguru ji ki fateh

If you have parkash of Guru Granth Sahib ji's saroop at your home and you actively do seva, what are you views on doing bhog to parshada?

Does it come down to your sharda or do Gursikhs believe in a set maryada for this?
What is Sri Akal Takhat Sahib's stance on this?
What was practiced by puratan Gursikhs?

vaheguru ji ka khalsa vaheguru ji ki fateh

Puraatan Singhs used to do Kirpan Bhet before consuming food but now this Rehit seems to have been lost. More research is required in this field.

Kulbir Singh

In one of the Katha, dass had heard that Mahapurash used to bring parshada-pani (in plate, katori and tumbler etc...) in hazoori of Guru Maharaaj (SGGS Jee) and he would sit there with Guru Maharaaj for approx 30 minutes. In these 30 minutes Mahapurash used to do seva of Guru Maharaaj by doing Kirtan and/or do some Paath. He used to make sure that Guru Maharaaj had parshada-pani properly. Only after that Mahapurash used to consume his parshada-pani.

Dass has no idea on Rehit of Kirpan Bheta of parshada-pani. But mostly in local Gurdwara have seen that while doing Kirpan Bheta of Degh, the sevadaar does the same with parshada-pani as well at the same time.

Bhul Chuk Maaf.

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa,
Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh.

I have no interest in debating Im only answering because a SIngh has asked me too.

Quote

What is Sri Akal Takhat Sahib's stance on this?
What was practiced by puratan Gursikhs?

There is overwhelming evidence that Bhog was done in Puratan times during the times of the Guru Sahiban ( dehdari Guru). Refer to Sakhia and Rehatnamey. There is even a Gurbani pangti which ask Guru Sahib to do bhog on food which has been prepared according to Maryada .


However, doing bhog on langar was no longer practiced after 1708 when Sri Guru Ji have gurgaddi to Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji.

Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaj is the atmic jot of Guru Sahiban. Bhai Sahib Bhai Randhir SIngh Ji mentions Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji MahaRaj is beyond cold weather and hot weather, and Maharaj Ji is beyond thirst and hunger. Bhai Sahib mentions to place additional clothing ( rumaley, chader, etc) on Sri Guru Ji according to the season is not in accordance to Gurmat, also to do bhog to Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji is not in accordance to Gurmat ( refer to his book Gurmat Parkaash pg 129)

Nanksar are not the only people who are practicing this ritual. Hazoor Sahib and Nihang Daals also practice the ritual of offering food to Maharaj Ji . They offer the food while performing aarti . Sri Akal Takht says that such a practice including Bhog ( offering food to Guru Sahib) is not in accordance to Gurmat. Refer to SGPC Rehat Maryada.

We know Puratan Gursikhs would offer food to Sri Guru Ji when he was present in 10 physical human bodies. We also know Gursikhs would get water from a river and do Ishnaan of Sri Guru Jis physical body, but after 1708 this practice was no longer needed . I remember in 2006, I went to Hazoor Sahib. I saw the locals offering food to Sri Guru Ji in addition they would wake up early in the morning and get water from the Godavri river and say the water was to bathe Sri Guru Ji. How this is done is beyound my understanding. We see many Gurdwara Sahibs today offering food to Sri Guru Ji, but when we ask them why they have no response. Sikhi is beyond rituals.

This is also practiced by Damdami Taksal, not just Nanaksar or Hazoor Sahib. Nanaksar has some influence from Hazoor Sahib.

Yeah I think Nanaksar is influenced by Hazoor Sahib as Baba Nand Singh Ji spent some time at Hazoor Sahib. I think Taksal has recently practiced this ritual. As far as I remember Giani Gurbachan Singh Ji does not mention doing bhog on langar? What I find strange is Sri Guru Ji banned food offerings in Jagannath Puri but we have re-established this ritual

Veer Sukhdeep Singh Ji, Excellent Response To This Question!



Amanjot Singh

I think it all comes down to your devotion and I personally don't think anything is wrong in having special utensils in which one puts food in and puts in front of Waheguru to take and bless. Just make food and put it in a plate and then place it somewhere clean, and talk to God to accept it. The food actually does feel better to eat because it's been offered to Waheguru first, so it's blessed.

This can be done with devotion even when you don't have Guru Sahib at home in sarroop form. Because God's everywhere.

Food is food. Just eat it.
All this trying to offer food to God sounds Brahmanic to me. thatz what hindus do to murtis at mandirs.
Doing bhog to kraah prashaad to is an age old practice and there's nothing that should be done to stop it. Food can be cooked and eaten, but degh has to be made every time there is some sort of a smagam and brought to darbar. just some thoughts.

It might sound brahamanic to you but that doesn't prove it that it is. It all comes down to how one is connected to God and how they want to practice their devotion. There are many ways people pray to God and just like God has many names and He listens no matter how we call out to Him, He recognizes us and simply responds. And no, food is not just food either. That's what I believe anyways - it's not necessary that another must think like that too.

Sukhdeep Singh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I have no interest in debating Im only answering
> because a SIngh has asked me too.
>
>
>
> What is Sri Akal Takhat Sahib's stance on this?
> What was practiced by puratan Gursikhs?
>
> There is overwhelming evidence that Bhog was done
> in Puratan times during the times of the Guru
> Sahiban ( dehdari Guru). Refer to Sakhia and
> Rehatnamey. There is even a Gurbani pangti which
> ask Guru Sahib to do bhog on food which has been
> prepared according to Maryada .
>
>
> However, doing bhog on langar was no longer
> practiced after 1708 when Sri Guru Ji have
> gurgaddi to Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji.
>
> Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaj is the atmic jot
> of Guru Sahiban. Bhai Sahib Bhai Randhir SIngh Ji
> mentions Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji MahaRaj is
> beyond cold weather and hot weather, and Maharaj
> Ji is beyond thirst and hunger. Bhai Sahib
> mentions to place additional clothing ( rumaley,
> chader, etc) on Sri Guru Ji according to the
> season is not in accordance to Gurmat, also to do
> bhog to Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji is not in
> accordance to Gurmat ( refer to his book Gurmat
> Parkaash pg 129)
>
> Nanksar are not the only people who are practicing
> this ritual. Hazoor Sahib and Nihang Daals also
> practice the ritual of offering food to Maharaj Ji
> . They offer the food while performing aarti . Sri
> Akal Takht says that such a practice including
> Bhog ( offering food to Guru Sahib) is not in
> accordance to Gurmat. Refer to SGPC Rehat
> Maryada.
>
> We know Puratan Gursikhs would offer food to Sri
> Guru Ji when he was present in 10 physical human
> bodies. We also know Gursikhs would get water
> from a river and do Ishnaan of Sri Guru Jis
> physical body, but after 1708 this practice was no
> longer needed . I remember in 2006, I went to
> Hazoor Sahib. I saw the locals offering food to
> Sri Guru Ji in addition they would wake up early
> in the morning and get water from the Godavri
> river and say the water was to bathe Sri Guru Ji.
> How this is done is beyound my understanding. We
> see many Gurdwara Sahibs today offering food to
> Sri Guru Ji, but when we ask them why they have no
> response. Sikhi is beyond rituals.


- you have no right over someone's love for sikhe - just accept it and move on - it;s their way of showing prem/love affection - criticising is not going to help is it?

Sukhdeep Singh, if we use the logic that by doing bhog to langar it is treating Guru Sahib like a human than the same concept can be used for degh as well. Apparently, this is a tradition that was prelevent in the panth, but recently not many practice it anymore. I do agree that treating Guru Sahib like they are deh roop, and get hungry, cold, hot etc. is pure manmat, but doing bhog to langar doesn't mean we are treating Guru Sahib as a human. Like doing bhog to degh, it is similar, and only Guru Sahib knows the mystical reasoning behind it.

Gurman SIngh Ji, bhog and degh langar are two completley different practices. Doing Bhog on Degh was established by Sri Guru Arjan Dev Ji as a means of "acceptance" . Sri Guru Ji touched the degh which meant it was accepted and then it was distrubted to the sangat. Sri Hargobind Sahib Ji changed the maryada from his hand to his teer ( arrow). Sri Guru Gobind SIngh Ji finalized the tradition changing it from teer to kirpan, and said the first five portions will be given to the panj pyaarey who are the Gurus body.Sri Guru Ji stared this tradition and thus no mortal can modify or abolish the practice. Nowhere in history have I read the same tradition exist for doing bhog on langar. Can you provide just ONE reference where Khalsa Ji did bhog to langar in the presence of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji after 1708? The practice of food offering is contradictory to Gurmat and was first initiated by Brahmins as a daily routine they would bathe and then indulge in food offering to idol stones ( thakur). I dont think its right to treat Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji as an idol. Guru is shabad not body.

Secondly the practice of offering food to Sri Guru Ji when they where in their physical body was not a set maryada. The practice was first done by Gursikhs who could not bare taking langar before their Guru. But this was not a set ( permanent) maryada. In fact there are some occassions where this didnt take place. For example, when Sri Guru Ji and Mardana went to Bhai Lalo jis house to chhak langar Mardana was the first to eat.

ns44 Jee, Bhagat Dhaan Ji and Bhagat Naamdev Ji also indulged in the Brahmin practice of offering food . Yes they did this out of innocent love. THis doesnt make it right though. If Gursikhs are doing such practices out of innoncent love they should learn the history behind what they are doing. Sikhi is beyond rituals. True love is for Gurshabad.

Bhai Sukhdeep Singh ji, who is Bhagat Dhaan Ji?
Please chaanan paao

Bhai Sukhdeep Singh Jee - you're right , however it's not a bujjar kurehit or anything is it, so let's calm the rethoric and focus on areas in Sikhe which have major major issues. If I told you there are stories of Baba Nand Singh jee not having no food or anything till Guru Nanak Sahib jee appeared before him in presence, the rumallas of SGGS became clothes and Guru Nanak Dev jee gave darshan - so is that all jackonary stories - all that prem pyar Baba Jee had is a lie. ?

I meant to say bhagat dhanna ji

When Langar is prepared, before distributing it to Sangat, an Ardaas is done in Rasoyee for acceptance of Langar Seva. It's here that Kirpan Bhet is done to Langar but at this time this Maryada is not uniformly followed. In some places just an Ardaas is done and at other places Ardaas and Kirpan Bhet is done.

If at least an Ardaas for Parvaangi of Langar Seva is not done, then how could such Langar become Guru ka Langar. Since Ardaas has to be performed, this is why all Langar Sevadaars must be Suchay (Keshi Ishnaan done) and wear Sucha Gurmukhi Baana as is the practice at all Samagams organized by Sarblohi Bibeki Gurmukhs.

One reason why this practice is not widely practiced now a days is that at most places Langar is not prepared in Sarbloh by Tyaar bar Tyaar Gurmukhs. Langar prepared by Patits and Niguray people cannot be Guru ka Langar.

Kulbir Singh

Kulbir Singh Jee,

Doing ardas for Guru Ka Langar is completely different then offering food to Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji ( Bhog) a practice which is prevalent within Nanaksar Deras, Nihang Deras, and Hazoor Sahib. The practice is not in line with Gurmat as Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji is beyond cold and heat, hunger and thirst.

NS44 Jee - Can you provide any written statements where Baba Nand Singh Ji has provided such statements. Many people make up things about the maryada he promoted without providing any proof. Some say Baba JI encouraged people to fast on pooranmashi, some even say he use to do simran on Sri Guru Nanak Dev Jis photo but there is no proof. I have a hard time believing he would do these things. IF he did these things then this doesnt make it right .

Sukhdeep Singh jee- you have read the bio of Baba Nand Singh jee- i'm not sure of an online one out there. I have read it - been to the Nanaksar Ludihana place - can assure it ain't fancy jackonary stories once you pay a visit to the place you'll know what i mean.

I haven't heard anywhere of about "Baba JI encouraged people to fast on pooranmashi, some even say he use to do simran on Sri Guru Nanak Dev Jis photo but there is no proof"

let's stick to the topic veero - I agree langar/parshad bhog - ardaass should be done by amritdhari singh/kaurs.

I have been confused about this too, because in Bhai Nand Laal Singh Ji's RehatNama, mukhvaak of Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji is as follows:

ਚੌਪਈ
Chaupaee



ਅਰਦਾਸ ਬਿਨਾ ਜੋ ਕਾਜ ਸਿਧਾਵੇ
Aradaas Binaa Jo Kaaj Sidhaavay

Without supplication one who commences a task,


ਭੇ ਟ ਕੀਏੇ ਬਿਨ ਕੁਛ ਮੁਖ ਪਾਵੈ ॥ (੩੧)
Bhayt Keeayay Bin Kuchh Mukh Paavai ॥ (੩੧)

Prior to offering, puts something in the mouth.(31)


ਤਿਆਗੀ ਬਸਤ ਗਹਿਣ ਜੇ ਕਰੈ
Tiaagee Basat Gahin Jay Karai

Abandoned belongings, one who takes away,


ਬਿਨ ਤ੍ਰ੍ਰਿਯਾ ਆਪਣੀ ਸੇਜ ਜੋ ਧਰੋ ॥ (੩੨)
Bin Trriyaa Aapanee Sayj Jo Dharo ॥ (੩੨)

And takes an other’s wife to the bed,(32)


ਅਤਿਥਿ ਵੇਖ ਨਹੀਂ ਦੇਵੈ ਦਾਨ
Atidi Vaykh Naheen Dayvai Daana

One who does not serve an approaching guest,


ਸੋ ਨਹੀਂ ਪਾਵੈ ਦਰਗਹਿ ਮਾਨ ॥ (੩੩)
So Naheen Paavai Daragahi Maan ॥ (੩੩)

He won’t be honoured in the divine court.(33)

What about offering flowers to Guru Sahib? Isn't that brahamanic too then?