ਨਾਨਕ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤੁ ਏਕੁ ਹੈ ਦੂਜਾ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤੁ ਨਾਹਿ

What I am going to ask is going to sound a bit offensive, even though it is a genuine question that has been running in my mind for years. Whenever I have asked a GurSikh about this, all I have got is an angry attitude rather than a convincing answer. I am not from a Sikh family and may be that is why I do not understand certain things, which make me question them if I do not understand, so please bear with me. It is something that always seems confusing, so I am going to ask here. If anyone is uncomfortable replying over here, please send a private message no matter how harsh it has to be. I request the Admins to reject/lock this topic if they feel it would lead to another unpleasant thread, but even then please do respond to me in a private message, I will be very thankful.

Having said all that, let me proceed to ask the question. I have come across several instances where one is asked to pesh before the Panj Pyaare for the smallest and unintentional errors that happen or are committed. When I was blessed with Amrit at an AKJ rensabhai in 2004, the Panj Singhs said that you are to pesh only if a bajjar kurehit is committed. For other mistakes you are to do a sincere Ardas and beg for forgiveness. What I am going to say next is what may not be taken in good spirits, so I apologize in advance if I am unable to word my question appropriately. We all do know that ਨਾਨਕ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤੁ ਏਕੁ ਹੈ ਦੂਜਾ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤੁ ਨਾਹਿ ॥ O Nanak, there is only One Ambrosial Nectar; there is no other nectar at all. However, I have come across several individuals claiming to be of particular jathebandis who feel that “their Amrit” is “the best”, and that the others are “not really there”. Sorry but this is indeed the impression I have been given on more than one occasion, no matter which jathebandi it is.

My sincere and humble question to anyone who harbors such notions is that if they consider “ their Amrit” to be “the best”, why do they propose to pesh for the smallest and unintentional error. It just confuses me. What is best is powerful enough to not be affected by anything, and that is what Gurujee’s Amrit is. Why do some people give the impression that this divine blessing can be affected by mere mistakes? I am not naming any specific jathebandi here, because I do not want to offend anyone.

The Sikhi I fell in love with taught me that Guru Sahib is all-forgiving, that an Ardas done with faith is powerful enough to change destinies, and here I read about people suggesting to pesh if someone’s hair was cut off while they were asleep, or if someone experiences a ghostly presence around them. Please tell me what am I missing in terms of understanding Sikhi so that I may understand it better.

And yes, this time, seriously, vadh ghatt bolleya khima karna, bhull chukk maaf karni Khalsa jeeo

Mehtab Singh

I think you are right in claiming there is only one amrit. I think when people claim "their amrit is the best" they are saying that their jathebandi prepare amirt according to Maryada. Whenever I come across any person who wishes to pesh or take Amrit I always advise that they should take Amrit from sevadars who have a strong reputation for preparing according to Gurmat Maryada.

In his book, BHai Randhri Singh Ji mentions that when he first took Amrit some person came into the Amrit Sanchar and whispered some weird mantar in his ear. He also mentions how some people take AMrit but they feel no change, they feel like they havent started a new life. He goes on to mention people do not feel reborn because their Amrit Sanchar was not performed according to Maryada. Many times at the local Gurdwaras when performing Amrit Sanchar the organizers just get 5 random Sikhs and do not question their rehat. When Bhai Rama SIngh Ji got darshan of Dasmi Paatshah, Guru Sahib told him that amrit sanchars have become weak. He mentioned that he should do panj pyaarey seva and make sure both female and male abhilakhees are given 5 kakkars not 4 kakkars. Bhai Randhir Singh Ji mentions that in the past it was unheard of to give Amrit to abhilakee and not prescribe Sarab Loh bibek rehat. I think this is when Bhai Sahib stopped doing Seva when Sarab Loh bibek rehat was no longer made mandatory.

Thanks for your response Veer Sukhdeep Singh jee, however my question was: anyone who harbors such notions is that if they consider “their Amrit” to be “the best”, why do they propose to pesh for the smallest and unintentional error.

Also Is it allowed to go to an Amrit Sanchar done by AKJ JUST to get naam drirr? When no mistakes have been committed. I always hear about this, and it always leaves me dumbfounded how someone can go to an amritsanchar and get pesh when they havent commited a small sin let alone a BUJJER kureit

ੴਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫ਼ਤਹ॥

ਭਾਈ ਮਹਿਤਾਬ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀਉ,

ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕਾ ਖ਼ਾਲਸਾ। ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕੀ ਫ਼ਤਹ॥

ਆਪ ਜੀ ਨੇ ਜੋ ਸਵਾਲ ਰੱਖਿਆ ਹੈ ਉਸ ਨੂੰ ਅਗਰ ਦੋ ਹਿੱਸਿਆਂ ਵਿਚ ਵੰਡਿਆਂ ਲਿਆ ਜਾਵੇ ਤਾਂ ਸਮੱਸਿਆ ਨੂੰ ਸਮਝਣਾ ਕੁੱਝ ਸੋਖਾ ਹੋ ਜਾਵੇਗਾ।
ਪਹਿਲਾ ਭਾਗ:

Quote
“We all do know that [b]ਨਾਨਕ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤੁ ਏਕੁ ਹੈ ਦੂਜਾ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤੁ ਨਾਹਿ ॥[/b] O Nanak, there is only One Ambrosial Nectar; there is no other nectar at all. However, I have come across several individuals claiming to be of particular jathebandis who feel that “their Amrit” is “the best”, and that the others are “not really there”. Sorry but this is indeed the impression I have been given on more than one occasion, no matter which jathebandi it is…”

ਜਿਥੋ ਤਕ ਨਾਨਕ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤੁ ਏਕੁ ਹੈ ਦੂਜਾ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤੁ ਨਾਹਿ ॥ ਵਿਚਲਾ ਸ਼ੰਦੇਸ਼ ਬਿਲਕੁਲ ਸਪੱਸ਼ਟ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਇਕ ਹੀ ਹੈ ਦੂਸਰਾ ਕੋਈ ਨਹੀਂ। ਤਾਂ ਫਿਰ ਸੁਆਲ ਪੈਦਾ ਹੋਣਾ ਸੁਭਾਵਿਕ ਹੀ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਅੱਜ ਪੰਥ ਵਿਚਲੀਆ ਸਾਰੀਆਂ ਜਥੇਬੰਦੀਆ ਦੀ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਸੰਚਾਰ ਵਿਚ ਇਕ ਸੁਰਤਾ ਕਿਉਂ ਨਹੀਂ। ਮਿਸਾਲ ਦੇ ਤੌਰ ਤੇ ਬਾਟਾ ਤਿਆਰ ਕਰਨ ਲੱਗੇ ਇਸ ਬਾਬਤ ਤਾਂ ਸਾਰੇ ਇਕ ਮਤ ਹਨ ਕਿ ਪੰਜ ਪਿਆਰੇ ਬੀਰ ਆਸਨ ਵਿਚ ਬੈਠਣ ਪਰ ਕਈ ਇੱਕ ਨੇ ਬੀਰ ਆਸਣ ਵਿਚ ਵੀ ਫਰਕ ਪਾ ਲਿਆ ਹੈ ਉਹ ਕਹਿੰਦੇ ਹਨ ਬੀਰ ਆਸਣ ਖੱਬੇ ਗੋਡੇ ਨੂੰ ਜ਼ਮੀਨ ਨੂੰ ਲਾ ਕੇ ਬਣਦਾ ਪਰ ਪੰਥਕ ਤੌਰ ਤੇ ਮੰਨਿਆ ਜਾਂਦਾ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਸੱਜਾ ਗੋਡਾ ਜ਼ਮੀਨ ਨਾਲ ਲਾ ਕੇ ਖੱਬਾ ਉੱਚਾ ਰੱਖ ਕੇ ਬੀਰ ਆਸਣ ਲਾਇਆ ਜਾਵੇ। ਫਿਰ ਕਈਆਂ ਨੇ ਤਾਂ ਇਸ ਪ੍ਰਕਿਆ ਵਿਚ ਵੀ ਫ਼ਰਕ ਪਾ ਲਿਆ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਬਾਟਾ ਤਿਆਰ ਕਰਨ ਵਖਤ ਬਾਣੀ ਪੜਨ ਵਾਲਾ ਪਿਆਰਾ ਖੱਬਾ ਹੱਥ ਬਾਟੇ ਤੇ ਅਤੇ ਸੱਜੇ ਨਾਲ ਖੰਡਾ ਪਤਾਸਿਆ ਦੇ ਘੋਲ ਵਿਚ ਫੇਰੇ ਜੋ ਕਿ ਸਹੀ ਹੈ ਪਰ ਕਈ ਆਖਦੇ ਕਿ ਨਹੀ ਅਸੀਂ ਤਾਂ ਖੱਬੇ ਹੱਥ ਨਾਲ ਬਾਟਾ ਫੜਨ ਦੀ ਬਜਾਏ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਸਿੱਧੀ ਕਰਕੇ ਫੜਾਂਗੇ ਇਤ ਆਦਿਕ ਫਰਕ ਤਾਂ ਬਾਟਾ ਤਿਆਰ ਕਰਨ ਵੇਲੇ ਹੀ ਪਾ ਲਏ ਹਨ ਫਿਰ ਗੁਰਮੰਤਰ ਅਤੇ ਰਹਿਤ ਦ੍ਰਿੜਾਉਣ ਤੇ ਤਾਂ ਹੋ ਭੀ ਫ਼ਰਕ ਹੋ ਗਿਆ ਹੈ। ਇਹ ਸਭ ਕੁੱਝ ਕਿਉਂ ਹੋ ਗਿਆ ਹੈ ਇਸ ਦਾ ਸਹੀ ਉੱਤਰ ਤਾਂ ਗੁਰੂ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਜੀ ਹੀ ਦੇ ਸਕਦੇ ਹਨ ਪਰ ਜੋ ਗੱਲ ਦਾਸ ਨੇ ਪੁਰਾਤਨ ਸਿੰਘਾ ਦੀ ਸੰਗਤ ਵਿਚੋਂ ਸਿੱਖੀ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਬਾਵਜੂਦ ਇਹਨਾਂ ਛੋਟਿਆਂ ਫਰਕਾਂ ਦੇ ਅਸੀ ਤੁਸੀ ਕਿਸੇ ਨੂੰ ਅਸਿੱਖ ਨਹੀ ਆਖ ਸਕਦੇ ਅਗਰ ਉਹ ਕਿਸੇ ਹੋਰ ਜਥੇਬੰਦੀ ਤੋਂ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਲੈ ਕੇ ਪੰਥ ਵਿਚ ਸ਼ਾਮਲ ਹੁੰਦਾ ਹੈ। ਇਸ ਗੁੰਝਲ ਨੂੰ ਸਮਝਣ ਲਈ ਅਗਰ ਅਸੀਂ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਛਕਣ ਨੂੰ ਤਿੰਨ ਭਾਗਾਂ ਵਿਚ ਵੰਡ ਲਈਏ ਜਿਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਵਿਚੋਂ ਯੋਗ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਅਭਿਲਾਖੀ ਨੂੰ ਗੁਜ਼ਰਨਾ ਪੈਂਦਾ ਹੈ ਤਾਂ ਸ਼ਾਇਦ ਕੁਝ ਬਿਹਤਰ ਸਮਝ ਪਵੇ।

ਪਹਿਲਾ ਹਿੱਸਾ: ਖੰਡੇ ਦੀ ਪਾਹੁਲ ਦੀ ਪ੍ਰਾਪਤੀ
ਦੂਜਾ ਹਿੱਸਾ: ਗੁਰਮੰਤਰ ਦੀ ਪ੍ਰਾਪਤੀ
ਤੀਜਾ ਹਿੱਸਾ: ਰਹਿਤਾਂ ਦੀ ਪ੍ਰਾਪਤੀ
(ਦਾਸ ਇੱਥੇ ਇਹ ਮੰਨ ਕਿ ਚਲ ਰਿਹਾ ਕਿ ਮਰਦ ਤੇ ਔਰਤ ਇਕੋ ਜਿਹੇ ਹੀ ਪੰਜ ਕਕਾਰ ਪਹਿਨ ਕੇ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਸੰਚਾਰ ਵਿਚ ਸ਼ਾਮਲ ਹੋਏ ਹਨ। ਹਾਲਾਂ ਕਿ ਪਿਛਲੀ ਸਦੀ ਦੌਰਾਨ ਪੰਥਕ ਤੌਰ ਤੇ ਬੀਬੀਆਂ ਲਈ ਇੱਕ ਕਕਾਰ ਵਿਚ ਢਿਲਆਈ ਦਿੱਤੀ ਗਈ ਹੈ ਜੋ ਕਿ ਅਲੱਗ ਵਿਚਾਰਨ ਦਾ ਵਿਸ਼ਾ ਹੈ ਜਿਸ ਕਾਰਨ ਅੱਧਾ ਪੰਥ ਇਕ ਕਕਾਰ ਹੀਣ ਹੀ ਹੈ)

ਪਹਿਲੇ ਹਿੱਸੇ ਵਿਚ ਖੰਡੇ ਦੀ ਪਾਹੁਲ ਦੀ ਤਿਆਰੀ ਅਤੇ ਪੰਜਾ ਸਿੰਘਾ ਵਲੋਂ ਅਭਿਲਾਖੀ ਨੂੰ ਪੰਜ-ਪੰਜ ਚੂਲੇ ਦੇਣ ਤੱਕ ਸਮੇਤ ਪੰਜ ਬਾਣੀਆ ਦੇ ਪੰਥਕ ਤੌਰ ਤੇ ਤਾਂ ਕੋਈ ਬਹੁਤਾ ਫ਼ਰਕ ਨਹੀ। ਹਾਂ ਕਿਸੇ ਸੰਪਰਦਾ ਨੇ ਇਸ ਵਿਚ ਵੀ ਤਬਦੀਲੀ ਕਰਕੇ ਨਵੀ ਰੀਤ ਚਲਾ ਲਈ ਹੋਵੇ ਤਾਂ ਇਹ ਓਸ ਸੰਪਰਦਾ ਜਾਂ ਡੇਰੇ ਦੀ ਹੋਵੇਗੀ ਪੰਥ ਦੀ ਨਹੀਂ।

ਹੁਣ ਦੂਜੇ ਹਿੱਸੇ ਵਿਚ ਪੰਥਕ ਤੌਰ ਤੇ ਜੇਕਰ ਕੋਈ ਫ਼ਰਕ ਪਿਆ ਹੈ ਤਾਂ ਉਹ ਹੈ ਗੁਰਮੰਤਰ ਨੂੰ ਦ੍ਰਿੜ ਕਰਵਾਉਣ ਦਾ ਜਿਸ ਵਿਚਲਾ ‘ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ’ ਸ਼ਬਦ ਤਾਂ ਸਾਰੇ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਸੰਚਾਰਾਂ ਵਿਚ ਇਕ ਹੀ ਹੈ ਪਰ ਪੰਚਾਂ ਵਿਚ ਸ਼ਾਮਲ ਸਿੰਘਾ ਦੇ ਆਪ ਦ੍ਰਿੜ ਨਾ ਹੋਣ ਕਾਰਨ ਉਹ ਦ੍ਰਿੜ ਨਹੀਂ ਕਰ ਪਾਉਂਦੇ ਪਰ ‘ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ’ ਸ਼ਬਦ ਜ਼ਰੂਰ ਦਿੱਤਾ ਜ਼ਾਦਾ ਹੈ।

ਤੀਜਾ ਹਿੱਸੇ ਵਿਚ ਵੀ ਪੰਥਕ ਤੌਰ ਤੇ ਜੇਕਰ ਕੋਈ ਫ਼ਰਕ ਪਿਆ ਹੈ ਤਾਂ ਬੱਜਰ ਕੁਰਿਹਤਾਂ ਵਿਚ ਸ਼ਾਮਲ ਕੁੱਠਾ ਅਤੇ ਰਹਿਤ ਵਿਚ ਸ਼ਾਮਲ ਕੇਸਕੀ ਦੀ ਢਿਲਆਈ ਤੇ। ਬਾਕੀ ਨੇਮਾਂ ਵਿਚ ਇਹ ਸਭ ਨੂੰ ਹੀ ਦੱਸਿਆ ਜਾਂਦਾ ਹੈ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਵੇਲੇ ਉਠ ਕੇ ਨਾਮ ਜਪਣਾ ਤੇ ਨਿਤਨੇਮ ਦੀਆਂ ਬਾਣੀਆਂ ਦਾ ਪਾਠ ਕਰਨਾ ਤੇ ਰੋਟੀ ਬੇਟੀ ਦੀ ਸਾਂਝ ਸਿਰਫ ਗੁਰਸਿੱਖਾ ਨਾਲ ਹੀ ਕਰਨੀ ਇਤਿ ਆਦਿ। ਇੱਥੇ ਇਕ ਗੱਲ ਹੋਰ ਨੋਟ ਕਰਨ ਵਾਲੀ ਹੈ ਰੋਟੀ ਬੇਟੀ ਦੀ ਸਾਂਝ ਵਾਲੇ ਬਿਬੇਕ ਨੂੰ ਵੀ ਪੂਰਨ ਤੌਰ ਨਹੀਂ ਦੱਸਿਆ ਜਾਂਦਾ ਅਤੇ ਸਰਬਲੋਹ ਦੀ ਗੱਲ ਹੀ ਦੂਰ ਹੈ।

ਦਾਸ ਇਥੇ ਜ਼ਿਆਦਾ ਵਿਸਥਾਰ ਵਿਚ ਜ਼ਿਆਦਾ ਨਾ ਜ਼ਾਦਾ ਹੋਇਆ ਇਹ ਹੀ ਆਖੇਗਾ ਕਿ ਥੋੜੇ ਬਹੁਤੇ ਫ਼ਰਕਾਂ ਤੋਂ ਇਲਾਵਾ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਸੰਚਾਰ ਦਾ ਬਹੁਤ ਸਾਰਾ ਹਿੱਸਾ ਇਕੋ ਜਿਹਾ ਹੀ। ਜਿਹੜਾ ਸਭ ਤੋਂ ਵੱਡਾ ਫ਼ਰਕ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਸੰਚਾਰ ਵਿਚ ਹੁੰਦਾ ਹੈ ਓਹ ਹੁੰਦਾ ਹੈ ਚੁਣੇ ਗਏ ਪੰਜਾ ਪਿਆਰਿਆਂ ਦਾ ਅਮਲੀ ਜੀਵਨ ਅਤੇ ਪੰਜਾਂ ਸਿੰਘਾ ਵਲੋਂ ਹੀ ਅਭਿਲਾਖੀ ਜਨ ਨੂੰ ਚੂਲੇ ਅਤੇ ਗੁਰਮੰਤਰ ਦੇਣਾ। ਜਿਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਰਾਹੀ ਗੁਰੂ ਜੋਤ ਨੇ ਵਰਤ ਕੇ ਆਪਣੀ ਕਲਾ ਕ੍ਰਿਸ਼ਮਣੀ ਜੁਗਤ ਅਭਿਲਾਖੀ ਜਨ ਤੇ ਵਰਤਾਉਣੀ ਹੁੰਦੀ ਹੈ ਜਿਸਨੂੰ ਕਿ ਸਿੱਖ ਨੇ ਉਮਰ ਪ੍ਰਯੰਤ ਕਮਾਉਣਾ ਹੁੰਦਾ ਹੈ। ਇਸ ਦੁਨੀਆ ਵਿਚ ਆਇਆ ਜੀਵ ਜਿਹੜਾ ਅਜੇ ਆਪਣੇ ਮਾਤਾ ਪਿਤਾ ਦਾ ਨਾਂਉ ਭੀ ਬੋਲਣਾ ਨਾ ਜਾਣਦਾ ਹੋਵੇ ਉਹ ਗੁਰੂ ਦੀ ਅਕਰਖਣ ਕਲਾ ਦੁਆਰਾ ਨਾਮ ਜਪੇ ਇਹ ਕ੍ਰਿਸ਼ਮਾ ਸਿਰਫ ਤੇ ਸਿਰਫ ਗੁਰੂ ਨਾਨਕ ਦੇ ਘਰ ਵਿਚ ਹੀ ਸੰਭਵ ਹੈ ਹੋਰ ਕਿਧਰੇ ਵੀ ਨਹੀਂ। ਜਾਹ ਜਾ ਕੇ ਦੁਨੀਆਂ ਟੱਕਰਾਂ ਮਾਰਦੀ ਫਿਰੇ ਤਾਂ ਮਾਰਦੀ ਰਹੇ ਕੋਈ ਪਰਵਾਹ ਨਹੀਂ ਪਰਮਾਤਮਾ ਦੇ ਸੱਚੇ ਨਾਮ ਦੀ ਪ੍ਰਾਪਤੀ ਸੱਚੇ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੂ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਗੁਰੂ ਨਾਨਕ ਦੇਵ ਜੀ ਦੇ ਦਰ ਤੋਂ ਪ੍ਰਾਪਤ ਹੋਵੇਗੀ ਹੋਰ ਕਿਤੋਂ ਵੀ ਨਹੀ।

ਖੈਰ, ਹੁਣ ਦਾਸ ਗੱਲ ਕਰੇ ਕਿ ਜਦੋਂ ਕੋਈ ਸਿੱਖ ਜਿਸਨੇ ਪਹਿਲੋਂ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਛਕਿਆ ਹੁੰਦਾ ਤਾਂ ਜਦੋਂ ਉਹ ਖਾਸ ਕਰਕੇ ਜਦੋਂ ਅਖੰਡ ਕੀਰਤਨੀ ਜੱਥੇ ਵੱਲੋਂ ਕੀਤੇ ਜਾ ਰਹੇ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਸੰਚਾਰ ਵਿਚ ਕਿਸੇ ਕਾਰਨ ਪੇਸ਼ ਹੁੰਦਾ ਹੈ ਤਾਂ ਅਗਰ ਉਸਨੇ ਬੱਜਰ ਕੁਰਹਿਤ ਨਹੀਂ ਕੀਤੀ ਤਾਂ ਉਸਨੂੰ ਦੁਬਾਰਾ ਖੰਡੇ ਦੀ ਪਾਹੁਲ ਨਹੀਂ ਦਿੱਤੀ ਜਾਂਦੀ ਕਿਉਂਕਿ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਵਿਚ ਫ਼ਰਕ ਨਹੀਂ ਹਾ ਉਸਨੂੰ ਗੁਰਮੰਤਰ ਦ੍ਰਿੜ ਕਰਵਾ ਦਿੱਤਾ ਜਾਂਦਾ ਹੈ ਅਤੇ ਬਾਕੀ ਸਾਰਿਆ ਦੇ ਨਾਲ ਹੀ ਕੁੱਠੇ ਦੀ ਬੱਜਰ ਕੁਰਹਿਤ ਅਤੇ ਪੰਜ ਕਕਾਰੀ ਰਹਿਤ ਦ੍ਰਿੜ ਕਰਵਾਈ ਜਾਂਦੀ ਹੈ। ਸੋ ਇਸ ਕਰਕੇ ਨਾਨਕ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤੁ ਏਕੁ ਹੈ ਦੂਜਾ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤੁ ਨਾਹਿ ॥ ਜਿੱਥੇ ਤੱਕ ਦਾਸ ਨੂੰ ਜਾਣਕਾਰੀ ਹੈ ਘੱਟੋ ਘੱਟ ਜੱਥੇ ਦੇ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਸੰਚਾਰਾਂ ਵਿਚ ਇਸ ਗੱਲ ਦਾ ਦ੍ਰਿੜਤਾ ਨਾਲ ਪਹਿਰਾ ਦਿੱਤਾ ਜਾਂਦਾ ਹੈ। ਹੁਣ ਕੋਈ ਸਿੱਖ ਆਪਣੇ ਤੌਰ ਤੇ ਹੰਕਾਰ ਵਸ ਹੋ ਕਿਸੇ ਦੂਸਰੇ ਸਿੱਖ ਨੂੰ ਨੀਵਾਂ ਦਿਖਾਵੇ ਤਾਂ ਇਹ ਓਸ ਸਿੱਖ ਦੀ ਆਪਣੀ ਕਮੀ ਹੈ ਇਸ ਨਾਲ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਦੀ ਮਾਨਤਾ ਨੂੰ ਕੋਈ ਫ਼ਰਕ ਨਹੀਂ ਪੈਂਦਾ।

ਹੁਣ ਆਉਂਦੇ ਹਾਂ ਆਪ ਜੀ ਦੇ ਸਵਾਲ ਦੇ ਦੂਜੇ ਹਿੱਸੇ ਵੱਲ:

Quote
“I have come across several instances where one is asked to pesh before the Panj Pyaare for the smallest and unintentional errors that happen or are committed…The Sikhi I fell in love with taught me that Guru Sahib is all-forgiving, that an Ardas done with faith is powerful enough to change destinies, and here I read about people suggesting to pesh if someone’s hair was cut off while they were asleep,…”

ਇਹ ਤਾਂ ਆਪਣੇ ਮੰਨਣ ਤੇ ਨਿਰਭਰ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਕਿਹੜੀ smallest error ਹੈ ਜਾਂ ਨਹੀਂ ਪਰ ਦੇਖੋ ਕੇਸ ਕਤਲ ਹੋਣੇ ਪੂਰੇ ਪੰਥਕ ਤੌਰ ਤੇ ਬੱਜਰ ਕੁਰਹਿਤ ਵਿਚ ਸ਼ਾਮਲ ਹਨ ਚਾਹੇ ਕੋਈ ਵੀ ਕੁਰਹਿਤ ਜਾਣੇ ਵਿਚ ਹੋਏ ਜਾਂ ਅਣਜਾਣੇ ਵਿਚ ਗੁਰੂ ਸਰੂਪ ਪੰਜ ਪਿਆਰਿਆਂ ਕੋਲ ਪੇਸ਼ ਹੋਣਾ ਹੀ ਸੁਜਾਨ ਸਿੱਖ ਦੀ ਨਿਸ਼ਾਨੀ ਹੈ। ਬਾਕੀ ਗੁਰੂ ਸਰੂਪ ਪੰਜ ਜਾਣਨ ਕਿ ਕੀ ਫੈਸਲਾ ਕਰਨਾ ਹੈ ਆਪਾਂ ਇਕੱਲੇ ਹੀ ਕੋਈ ਫੇਸਲਾਂ ਥੋੜੀ ਕਰ ਸਕਦੇ ਹਾਂ ਫਿਰ ਤਾਂ ਉਹ ਗੱਲ ਹੋ ਗਈ “ਸਲਾਮੁ ਜਬਾਬੁ ਦੋਵੈ ਕਰੇ ਮੁੰਢਹੁ ਘੁਥਾ ਜਾਇ ॥”

ਕਾਹਨੂੰ ਮਨ ਪਿੱਛੇ ਲੱਗ ਆਪ ਗੁਰੂ ਨਾਲੋਂ ਟੁੱਟਣ ਵਾਲੀ ਗੱਲ ਕਰਨੀ ਹੈ। ਦਾਸ ਨੇ ਤਾਂ ਇਥੋ ਤੱਕ ਵੀ ਸਿੰਘ ਦੇਖੇ ਹਨ ਜਿਹੜੇ ਕਿਸੇ ਵੀ ਤਰ੍ਹਾਂ ਦੀ ਸਰਜਰੀ ਭਾਵੇਂ ਕਿ ਹਾਰਟ ਦੀ ਹੀ ਕਰਨ ਵਾਲੀ ਕਿਉਂ ਨਾ ਹੋਵੇ ਨਹੀਂ ਕਰਵਾਉਦੇਂ। ਆਖਦੇ ਨੇ ਹੁਣ ਤਾਂ ਜਿਹੜਾ ਹਾਰਟ ਚਲਦਿਆਂ ਫਿਰਦਿਆਂ ਸਵਾਸ ਪੂਰੇ ਹੋ ਕੇ ਰੁਕ ਜਾਏ ਤਾਂ ਰੁਕ ਜਾਏ ਫਿਰ ਤਾਂ ਇਸ ਜਹਾਨ ਤੋਂ ਹੀ ਜਾਵਾਂਗੇ ਪਰ ਜੇ ਅਪਰੇਸ਼ਨ ਥੇਟਰ ਵਿਚ ਰੋਮਾਂ ਦੀ ਬੇਅਦਬੀ ਕਰਕੇ ਹਾਰਟ ਨੂੰ ਠੀਕ ਕਰਦਿਆ ਇਹ ਬੰਦ ਹੋ ਗਿਆ ਤਾਂ ਦੋਵੇਂ ਜਹਾਨਾਂ ਤੋਂ ਜ਼ਾਦੇ ਲੱਗਾਂਗੇ ਭਾਵ ਪਤਿਤ ਹੋ ਕੇ ਗੁਰੂ ਤੋਂ ਵੀ ਬੇਮੁੱਖ ਹੋ ਜਾਵਾਂਗੇ। ਸੋ ਇੰਨਾ ਅਕੀਦਾ ਹੈ ਸਿੱਖਾਂ ਦਾ ਆਪਣੇ ਗੁਰੂ ਪ੍ਰਤੀ। ਬਾਕੀ ਰਹੀ ਗੱਲ ਛੋਟੀਆਂ ਮੋਟੀਆਂ ਭੁੱਲਾਂ ਦੀ ਤਾਂ ਉਹ ਜਿਵੇਂ ਆਪ ਜੀ ਨੂੰ ਪੰਜਾਂ ਨੇ ਹਦਾਇਤ ਕੀਤੀ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਆਪਣੀ ਅਰਦਾਸ ਆਪ ਹੀ ਕਰੋਂ ਅਤੇ ਵੱਧ ਤੋਂ ਵੱਧ ਨਾਮ-ਬਾਣੀ ਵਿਚ ਜੁਟੋਂ ਤਾਂ ਕਿ ਅਗਾਂਹ ਤੋਂ ਬਚਾ ਰਹੇ।

ਪਰ ਅਗਰ ਹਦਾਇਤ ਇਹ ਮਿਲੀ ਹੋਈ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਕੋਈ ਪਤਿਤ ਵੀ ਤੁਹਾਡੇ ਨਾਲ ਖੈ ਕੇ ਲੰਘ ਜਾਵੇ ਤਾਂ ਪੇਸ਼ ਹੋ ਜਾਵੋ ਤਾਂ ਤੇ ਭਾਈ ਤੁਹਾਡਾ ਤਾਂ ਹਰ ਹਾਲਤ ਵਿਚ ਪੇਸ਼ ਹੋਣਾ ਬਣਦਾ ਹੀ ਬਣਦਾ ਹੈ।

ਬਾਕੀ ਲਿਖਦਿਆਂ ਹੋਇਆਂ ਅਗਰ ਕੋਈ ਸ਼ਬਦ ਕਿਸੇ ਦੀ ਸ਼ਾਨ ਦੇ ਖਿਲਾਫ਼ ਲਿਖਿਆਂ ਗਿਆਂ ਹੋਵੇ ਤਾਂ ਦਾਸ ਨਿਮਰਤਾ ਸਹਿਤ ਖਿਮਾਂ ਦਾ ਜਾਚਕ ਹੋਵੇਗਾ।

ਗੁਰੂ ਚਰਨਾਂ ਦੇ ਭੌਰਿਆਂ ਦਾ ਦਾਸ,
ਜਸਜੀਤ ਸਿੰਘ

gsingh jio,

Waheguru Ji ka Khalsa, Waheguru Ji ki Fateh

Quote
Also Is it allowed to go to an Amrit Sanchar done by AKJ JUST to get naam drirr? When no mistakes have been committed. I always hear about this, and it always leaves me dumbfounded how someone can go to an amritsanchar and get pesh when they havent commited a small sin let alone a BUJJER kureit

Yes, if one is eligible after Peshi Abhlakhi will be granted the Naam Drirr. But do not forget once you are eligible you will receive full package of do’s and don'ts including not to read raagmala. I am sorry to say only one content can not be delivered.

With Regards,
Daas

Well said Bhai Jasjit Singh ji.
However, I do believe that at almost every Amrit Sanchar organized by Jatha, Abhilaakhis who have chakked Amrit before, but outside of Jatha, are given full Amrit in Jatha, and then they are given Naam Daat.

Mehtab Singh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Thanks for your response Veer Sukhdeep Singh jee,
> however my question was: anyone who harbors such
> notions is that if they consider “their
> Amrit” to be “the best”, why do they propose
> to pesh for the smallest and unintentional error.


I do understand your sentiments as many people do pesh over small mistakes. Fair enough if they do it once or twice but if they make a habit of peshing for small reasons then they are turning the whole amrit sanchar as a mere ritual. I personally believe small mistakes can be forgiven through naam abhyiaas , seva, ardas etc. At the same time there are conservative groups that do encourage people to pesh over small things as they believe this will encourage people to be more vigilant in committing small errors.

JASJIT SINGH Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> gsingh jio,
>
> Waheguru Ji ka Khalsa, Waheguru Ji ki Fateh
>
>
>
>
>
> Yes, if one is eligible after Peshi Abhlakhi will
> be granted the Naam Drirr. But do not forget once
> you are eligible you will receive full package of
> do’s and don'ts including not to read raagmala.
> I am sorry to say only one content can not be
> delivered.
>
> With Regards,
> Daas

From What I have heard, Amrit Sanchars done by the AKJ, here in BC and some other places, do not give hukam to the singhs/singhnees to NOT read raagmala. They have a choice of whether they want to read it or not. So would you say these Amrit Sanchars are not in Full alliance with the "AKJ Maryada" ??



Jaspreet Singh Jee, what do you mean "full amrit"? is the amrit given by NON-AKJ not full amrit? Is it incomplete?

Quote
gsingh
what do you mean "full amrit"? is the amrit given by NON-AKJ not full amrit? Is it incomplete?

I'm sure Bhai Jaspreet Singh ji meant "full Amrit" as in the abhilakhi is given Amrit all over again five times in kesh, eyes and mouth as you would normally receive. It wouldn't make sense for Punj Piare to only give you Amrit five times to drink and not the "full" way.

There is no concept of "Choola" in the Jatha, so "full Amrit" would be given. How can one get Naam Dhrir without receiving Amrit at the same time? There is nothing more to it. In no way does this suggest that the prior Amrit received is invalid. Amrit is chakked when receiving Naam. That is all. Lucky souls!

Veer Jasjit Singh jee, bohot bohot dhannvaad. Meherbani karke "ਪਰ ਅਗਰ ਹਦਾਇਤ ਇਹ ਮਿਲੀ ਹੋਈ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਕੋਈ ਪਤਿਤ ਵੀ ਤੁਹਾਡੇ ਨਾਲ ਖੈ ਕੇ ਲੰਘ ਜਾਵੇ ਤਾਂ ਪੇਸ਼ ਹੋ ਜਾਵੋ ਤਾਂ ਤੇ ਭਾਈ ਤੁਹਾਡਾ ਤਾਂ ਹਰ ਹਾਲਤ ਵਿਚ ਪੇਸ਼ ਹੋਣਾ ਬਣਦਾ ਹੀ ਬਣਦਾ ਹੈ।" de arth angrejji ch samjhaa deyo.

gsingh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> JASJIT SINGH Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > gsingh jio,
> >
> > Waheguru Ji ka Khalsa, Waheguru Ji ki Fateh
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Yes, if one is eligible after Peshi Abhlakhi
> will
> > be granted the Naam Drirr. But do not forget
> once
> > you are eligible you will receive full package
> of
> > do’s and don'ts including not to read
> raagmala.
> > I am sorry to say only one content can not be
> > delivered.
> >
> > With Regards,
> > Daas
>
> From What I have heard, Amrit Sanchars done by the
> AKJ, here in BC and some other places, do not give
> hukam to the singhs/singhnees to NOT read
> raagmala. They have a choice of whether they want
> to read it or not. So would you say these Amrit
> Sanchars are not in Full alliance with the "AKJ
> Maryada" ??
>
>
>
> Jaspreet Singh Jee, what do you mean "full amrit"?
> is the amrit given by NON-AKJ not full amrit? Is
> it incomplete?


Because Sri Akal Takht has already given the hukum that one may or may not recite Raag Mala according to ones wishes the decision has already been made. I dont think AKJ sanchars say things that go against Hukums against Sri AKal Takht Sahib. They might not say dont read Raag Mala, but they will be honest in saying what Raag Mala is. When I took amrit at a Sanchar I dont remember them mentioning not to read Raag Mala. If they would of gave the hukum to then obviously one cant read Raag Mala.

In addition, if one gets naam they have to follow the rehats given at the Amrit Sanchar. I know some clever people who get naam drir and because out of mere weakness they cant follow certain rehat they pesh with Taksal or Nanaksar jatha. They then say they no longer have to follow previous rehats. Whenever we pesh and there is a difference in maryada then we have follow the maryada which is most stricter and according to maryada. We can treat naam as though its a cheap object in which we dont have to offer anything in return. People who think like this dont go far with naam.

WHen Jaspreet Singh is saying full amrit I think he is referring to Full Amrit as opposed to "chula"?

Bhai Mehtab Singh ji, I'm not sure what you’re aiming to get from this thread.

Basically, you are dwelling on other gursikhs feeling the need to pesh. If one is feeling the need to pesh then that surely is up to the individual and does not concern you or I. If someone feels the need to pesh then surely, they should do so.

You may feel that a mistake is "small" but it may not be to someone else. The option of going "Pesh" is not only reserved for bujjhar kurrhetts but for any other reason that can be of concern to a gursikh. Presenting yourself before the Panj Piare is no crime nor should it be seen as something negative. Why not deal with your errors here on this planet when you have the option instead of carrying the weight with you to Dargah?

"NirbaanKirtan" jeeo, I haven't asked anyone who wanted to pesh as to "why do you want to pesh". My question is for those, who on one hand claim that the jathebandi where they took Amrit from is "better" than others, and at the same time require a peshi for every mistake committed. True, its an individual's decision if they want to pesh or not, and its an individualistic perspective as to what is a small mistake and what is a bigger one, agreed. However, the way it is propagated would (to an ignorant creature like myself) sound like they are trying to say that Amrit gets affected because of mistakes. I just don't agree that Amrit is a "weak" thing, thats all. It just doesn't make sense to say that something which is "the best" could be "weak" as well. Other than that, I am no one to comment on anyone's wishes to pesh before Panj Pyaare. Their darshan is a blessing in itself that is achieved by kirpa, no doubt about that. As far as what I am going to get by this thread, I had requested the admins in the beginning itself to reject/lock it if they feel it will get ugly. In the past as well I have received unpleasant reactions to such questions, even though it was asked out of curiosity. I am not at a higher spiritual level like others that I could accept everything out of faith. I don't think there is anything wrong to ask a question if one needs to learn. If it has made anyone feel uncomfortable, then my apologies, and I will refrain from asking such questions in future.

In the past as well I have received unpleasant reactions to such questions, even though it was asked out of curiosity - referred to asking certain people and not asking on GurmatBibek forum.

Mehtab Singh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> In the past as well I have received unpleasant
> reactions to such questions, even though it was
> asked out of curiosity - referred to asking
> certain people and not asking on GurmatBibek
> forum.


There is no such thing as a bad question the only bad question is the question not asked. Yes its true these type of questions have tendencies to create controversy however, during times of controversy many people learn For example, through this thread I have learned that AKJ is against "Chula". This is something I did not know before.

"WAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA WAHEGURU JI KI FATHE" BHAI JASPREET SINGH JIO you mentioned that SHRI AKAAL THAKHAT SAHIB GAVE HUKAM that one may or may not recite ragmala.But bhai sahib jio before ddt rebuilt SHRI AKAL THAKATH SAHIB aftre 1984 atacks no ragmala read on SHRI AKAL THAKAT SAHIB.AND akj follow this maryada as explaind by BBHAI JASPREET SINGH JI.Another thing that akj done amrit sanchar in BC and left decison on amrit abhilakhi about reading or not reading ragmala. BUT FROM BHAI SAHIB RANDHIR SINGHS time in every amrit sanchar in india punj singh sahibs asked for not reading of ragmala. bhul chuk muaf dasin dass

Quote

For example, through this thread I have learned that AKJ is against "Chula".

As per Maryada, the Punj only distribute Amrit to the Abhilakhis, regardless of age or gender. There is no historical document/evidence that proves the concept of "Chuhla" was started by any of the Guru's. The historical records that talk about the Vaisakhi of 1699 only refer to FULL AMRIT being given to anyone who got Pesh.
Sikhi is supposed to be full, not half way or partial, therefore AMRIT has to be FULL.
I doubt Chotey Sahibzaday were not given FULL AMRIT.

Quote

"WAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA WAHEGURU JI KI FATHE" BHAI JASPREET SINGH JIO you mentioned that SHRI AKAAL THAKHAT SAHIB GAVE HUKAM that one may or may not recite ragmala.But bhai sahib jio before ddt rebuilt SHRI AKAL THAKATH SAHIB aftre 1984 atacks no ragmala read on SHRI AKAL THAKAT SAHIB.AND akj follow this maryada as explaind by BBHAI JASPREET SINGH JI.Another thing that akj done amrit sanchar in BC and left decison on amrit abhilakhi about reading or not reading ragmala. BUT FROM BHAI SAHIB RANDHIR SINGHS time in every amrit sanchar in india punj singh sahibs asked for not reading of ragmala. bhul chuk muaf dasin dass

Brother, where did I talk about ragmala?
As far as I am concerned, Bhai Mehtab Singh ji started this thread to talk about AMRIT, I don't know how it suddenly became sidetracked and moved on to ragmala. I personally don't care a lot if someone thinks ragmala is Baani because some people just won't change their views, no matter how much proof/evidence you show them. Its totally upto Vaheguroo to give them an understanding of True, pristine GURMAT.

Please, a humble request, shall we not set foot in such troublesome issues. Let's focus on Bhai Mehtab Singh ji's question. Whether some jathebandi thinks ragmala is Baani because previous Singhs in their group believed it to be so, is not really the issue here. Let's refrain from sparking up another debate that will only lead to disasters.

Bhai Mehtab Singh jio,

Waheguru Ji ka khalsa, Waheguru Ji ki Fateh

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Veer Jasjit Singh jee, bohot bohot dhannvaad. Meherbani karke "ਪਰ ਅਗਰ ਹਦਾਇਤ ਇਹ ਮਿਲੀ ਹੋਈ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਕੋਈ ਪਤਿਤ ਵੀ ਤੁਹਾਡੇ ਨਾਲ ਖੈ ਕੇ ਲੰਘ ਜਾਵੇ ਤਾਂ ਪੇਸ਼ ਹੋ ਜਾਵੋ ਤਾਂ ਤੇ ਭਾਈ ਤੁਹਾਡਾ ਤਾਂ ਹਰ ਹਾਲਤ ਵਿਚ ਪੇਸ਼ ਹੋਣਾ ਬਣਦਾ ਹੀ ਬਣਦਾ ਹੈ।" de arth angrejji ch samjhaa deyo.

Never mind the last sentence, literally that has no meaning because such instruction never existed unless you take it as an ironic sentence which indicates that if instructions were given so extreme level that even if a patit passed by touching you then you should go back for a peshi.

With Regards,
Daas

I got my answers Gurmukh pyaareyo, thanks to all for posting.

Quote

ਵਾਰੀ ਖਸਮੁ ਕਢਾਏ ਕਿਰਤੁ ਕਮਾਵਣਾ ॥
The Lord and Master gives them their turn, according to the deeds they have done.

ਮੰਦਾ ਕਿਸੈ ਨ ਆਖਿ ਝਗੜਾ ਪਾਵਣਾ ॥
Do not speak ill of others, or get involved in arguments.

ਨਹ ਪਾਇ ਝਗੜਾ ਸੁਆਮਿ ਸੇਤੀ ਆਪਿ ਆਪੁ ਵਞਾਵਣਾ ॥
Do not get into arguments with the Lord, or you shall ruin yourself.

ਜਿਸੁ ਨਾਲਿ ਸੰਗਤਿ ਕਰਿ ਸਰੀਕੀ ਜਾਇ ਕਿਆ ਰੂਆਵਣਾ ॥
If you challenge the One, with whom you must abide, you will cry in the end.

ਜੋ ਦੇਇ ਸਹਣਾ ਮਨਹਿ ਕਹਣਾ ਆਖਿ ਨਾਹੀ ਵਾਵਣਾ ॥
Be satisfied with what God gives you; tell your mind not to complain uselessly.

ਵਾਰੀ ਖਸਮੁ ਕਢਾਏ ਕਿਰਤੁ ਕਮਾਵਣਾ ॥੩॥
The Lord and Master gives them their turn, according to the deeds they have done. ||3||

After reading this Shabad, I am going to shut up now. Once again, apologies if the question caused offense to any Guru pyaara.

Very well said by Bhai Jaspreet Singh ji. We should not rake up divisive issues.

We have close relations with family of Bhai sahib Bhai Randhir singh ji. Bhai
sahib was for unity of panth. His grandson is married into a Damdami taksal family.

Once Bhai sahib and sant Gurbachan Singh Bhindrewale attended a marriage ceremony
in Ludhiana District. Both were lodged in one room. They talked whole night about Gurmat
but never said a word about ragmala.

In the same way there was brotherly love between Bhai Ram Singh ji ( who was heading Jatha before Bhai sahib Pooran ji)
and Baba Thakar singh ji.

Quote

My sincere and humble question to anyone who harbors such notions is that if they consider “ their Amrit” to be “the best”, why do they propose to pesh for the smallest and unintentional error. It just confuses me. What is best is powerful enough to not be affected by anything, and that is what Gurujee’s Amrit is. Why do some people give the impression that this divine blessing can be affected by mere mistakes? I am not naming any specific jathebandi here, because I do not want to offend anyone.

Good question, Bhai Mehtab Singh jeeo.

This line of argument that since Amrit is very powerful, very valuable and very pure, therefore, mistakes done by people should not affect Amrit, is used by many people to avoid getting absolved in Sangat for their Kurehits. They are too proud to admit to their mistakes but they don't realize that it is easier to get pardoned for Kurehits here than in the Darbar of Dharam Rai.

The mistakes do not affect Amrit but affects the custodian of Amrit i.e. the person who has been given Amrit. If Amrit is a priceless jewel, then the custodian of this Amrit too has to stay very alert to avoid it getting stolen by thieves.

Bhai Sahib Randhir Singh jee has written a whole article on this subject. This article called Amrit Kala can be found in the book - Gurmat Vichaar. Some people at that time claimed that Amrit is too strong to get broken by mistakes and that there is no need to get pesh for Kurehits. Bhai Sahib refuted their claims and proved through Gurbani that indeed there are mistakes for whom we need to get pardoned by Guru Sahib.

Their line of argument is flawed because it's not Amrit that gets affected by mistakes but the person who commits Kurehits, loses the priceless jewel - Amrit. Access to Amrit only stays for such people who follow Guru Sahib's Hukams and they lose access to Amrit in proportion to their Tyaar-bar-Tyaar level. They totally lose access if they commit one of the 4 Bajjar Kurehits. Full access to the Amrit Nidhaan means that one's Naam Kamaaee and Gurbani Paath Kamaee is going 100% towards one's spiritual goal of achieving Naam.

There are two kinds of Mistakes - 1. Mistakes which require one to get Pesh; 2. Mistakes for which one can do Ardaas.

For Bajjar Kurehits, one has to get Pesh in the Darbar of Punj Pyare because one requires to get Amrit again. For non-Bajjar Kurehits but significant mistakes e.g. weakness in Bibek etc. one may get pesh in Sangat or go to the Darbar of Punj Pyare. Normally, if one is getting pesh for non-Bajjar Kurehit that is of personal nature, then too one should get pesh in the Darbar of Punj Pyare, so as to avoid making one's embarrassing mistake public.

For mistakes that are done unintentionally or are immaterial, one can do Ardaas before Guru Sahib for forgiveness.

There is no worst or best Amrit. Amrit is only one and that Amrit is one that is prepared with Gurmat Maryada. It's not about Jathebandis but about Maryada. Just because it has a label of a certain Jathebandi does not mean that all is well. The main thing is Gurmat Maryada. If Gurmat Maryada is followed, then alone Amrit Sinchaar is valid.

Amrit is a very priceless substance and any person who takes it for granted soon loses access to Amrit. A person who carelessly and fearlessly commits sins and then thinks that his Amrit is intact is mistaken. Bhai Gurdaas jee has given a great example to high light a Gurmat point to to destroy Bhagti, sometimes a small sin is enough:

ਵਿਗੜੈ ਚਾਟਾ ਦੁਧ ਦਾ ਕਾਂਜੀ ਦੀ ਚੁਖੈ॥ ਸਹਸ ਮਣਾ ਰੂਈ ਜਲੈ ਚਿਣਗਾਰੀ ਧੁਖੈ॥
(A whole pot of milk is spoiled by small amount of Kaanji (lemon juice) and tonnes of cotton burns with a small spark)

Same way, one Bajjar Kurehit destroys one's status of a Tyaar Bar Tyaar Khalsa. Each mistake that we commit against Gurmat, reduces our status of Tyaar-bar-Tyaar Gursikh. A quick way to reverse the affects of our mistakes is to confess in Sangat or Punj Pyare Darbaar (depending on the type of mistake it is).

Guru Sahib knows better.

Kulbir Singh

I know Kulbir Singh ji received naam drir in 90s from reading your article on an old forum, and am interested in what the marayda then was for those wishing to receive naam drir, were abhkalis given choola or full amrit?

In india amrit sanchars punj pyare often give just choola for those who require naam drir. Yet akj in india say amrit is only valid if prepared in hazzori of larivaar saroop. Now its quite obvious that other jathebanids and "normal" amrit sacnhars have prakash of pad ched, even if on a rare occasion there is larivaar saroop then the punj pyare may have taken amrit where pad ched saroop is prakashed. Another point is the punj pyare may follow akaltakth maraday which allows them to eat meat. So this is big dhilla by jatha to only give choola to those who want naam drir. If married, both need full amrit plus naam drir, and according to pratan marada they should also have their anand karaj repeated.

You can argue amrit is ek, but maradya sure isn't.

It is true that there is only one Amrit. Where there are Punj Tyar bar Tyar Gursikhs in the presence of Guru Granth Sahib Jee's Larivaar Saroop then and only then can Amrit be prepared. This Amrit can only be prepared with a very strict method and must be administered according to maryada as well.

How can those who do not live the life of a Gursikh, who have not received Gurmat Naam from Punj Naam Abhiyaasi Gursikhs in the presence of Guru Sahib's Saroop, be eligible to carry out the seva of Amrit sanchar?

How can you call that an Amrit sanchar, where Guru Sahib's Pavitar Saroop is not parkaash?

How can those who do not have full rehni behni of Gursikhs, do updesh to newborn khalsa?

I am not sure what those unfortunate beings who have gone to take Amrit, but have gone to a place where maryada was not followed, should be referred to as, but they should make haste in appearing in front of Punj Pyare where Tat Gurmat is being adhered to.

harsh singh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "WAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA WAHEGURU JI KI FATHE" BHAI
> JASPREET SINGH JIO you mentioned that SHRI AKAAL
> THAKHAT SAHIB GAVE HUKAM that one may or may not
> recite ragmala.But bhai sahib jio before ddt
> rebuilt SHRI AKAL THAKATH SAHIB aftre 1984 atacks
> no ragmala read on SHRI AKAL THAKAT SAHIB.AND akj
> follow this maryada as explaind by BBHAI JASPREET
> SINGH JI.Another thing that akj done amrit sanchar
> in BC and left decison on amrit abhilakhi about
> reading or not reading ragmala. BUT FROM BHAI
> SAHIB RANDHIR SINGHS time in every amrit sanchar
> in india punj singh sahibs asked for not reading
> of ragmala. bhul chuk muaf dasin dass


Bhai Sahib how can you say that the Damdami Taksal rebiult the Akaal Takhat. It was a panthic decision.

JASJIT SINGH Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Bhai Mehtab Singh jio,
>
> Waheguru Ji ka khalsa, Waheguru Ji ki Fateh
>
>
>
> Never mind the last sentence, literally that has
> no meaning because such instruction never existed
> unless you take it as an ironic sentence which
> indicates that if instructions were given so
> extreme level that even if a patit passed by
> touching you then you should go back for a peshi.
>

Bhai Sahib can you please make it clearer of what you are trying to say here?
>
> With Regards,
> Daas

WHAT A JOKE-- question will remain, as divisions are hard ridged wedges in between jathebandis' as clearly seen in the posts above.
on another note what do you think Guru sahib is thinking reading this thread???
It's a known fact we were given a simple system with the 4 bajjar kurehts and we have over the years made it a complex system of this and that
according to so and so and so forth--- No wonder there is no ekta and never will be , as those wedges and ridges over the years have become hard REAL hard as we keep feeding and brainwashing the oncoming generations with our own interpetations.
And we love to repeat the same over and over and over with no real debate on a particular high calibre gursikh or rehat - as soon as that happens we take it personally and trigger off emotionally....we 're no where near even with the patietence of the goras- the countries we live in -- to learn from them the thinking that goes in a debate and the outcome - fruitful becasue the goal is the same...our vision is my way or NO WAY

"Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji Ki Fathe" KHALSA JIO dass has no hurt to anyones heart.dass are also in the favour of panthak ekta.so plz dass dono hath jorh gall vich pala pa panth ton khima da jachak hai ji. Umeed hai panth dass de avgun dass de pale vich pa dass nu khima karega ji. guru panth da dass

AMRIT NAAM NIDHAAN HAI MIL PEEVO BHAI
JIS SIMRAT SUKH PAYEEAYE SAB TIKHA BUJHAI

Guru Sahib is talking about "naam" amrit here. If after amrit sanchar you havent tasted naam roop amrit then just imagine..

AMRIT HAR KA NAAM HAI JIT PEETE TIKH JAYEE
NANAK GURMUKH JIN PEEYA TIN BAHUR N LAGI AAYE

If you taste NAAM amrit, you will be liberated.

AMRIT HAR KA NAAM HAI VARSEY KIRPA DHAAR
NANAK GURMUKH NADRI AAYA HAR AATAM RAM MURAR.

Such is the magic of naam amrit.

HAR AMRIT BHAGAT BHANDAR HAI GUR SATGUR PAASE RAMRAJE

Satguru has khajana of Naam amrit and he gives it to us when we go in his sharan.

HAR AMRIT BHARE BHANDAAR SAB KISH HAI GHAR TIS KE BAL RAAM JIO

Just learning how to beg for this amrit, he may bless me with this some day.

Just trying to drink that amrit from the pool of amrit so that a crow like me could become hans.

AMRITSAR SATGUR SAT VADI JIT NAATE KAUAA HANS HOHEY.

AMRIT HAR PEEVTE SADA THIR THEEVTEY BIKHEY BAN FIKA JANIYA

That amrit is naam amrit.

AMRIT NAAM SUD BHUNCHIYE GURMUKH KAAR KAMAYE

And who can take that amrit:

AMRIT NAAM TERA SOI GAVE
JO SAHIB TERE MAN BHAVE
TU SANTAN KA SANT TUMARE
SANT SAHIB MAN MANA JIO.

I wish i get that naam amrit in my hirdey along with all the gursikhs.

NANAK AMRIT EK HAI DOOJA NAHIN KOI

Dass,

Kawaljit Singh