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Cold showers before amritvela

Posted by Mann Chaao 
Re: Cold showers before amritvela
November 29, 2010 08:32PM
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I was prompted to learn Urdu out of love for Urdu poetry, particularly poetry of legendary Urdu poet - Mirza Ghalib.

Are we allowed to love Mirza Ghalib poetry? Veer Ji, that confession may put you in trouble? Were you Amritdhari during this love? Veer Sukhdeep Singh Ji to help please.smiling bouncing smiley smiling bouncing smiley smiling bouncing smiley
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Daas had Arabic in school for 9 years and because of that I can read Urdu (a bit slowly) as well. Sri Jaap Sahib has loads of Arabic words.
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And veer Sukhdeep Singh ji,thanks for the insightful post. Makes sense.
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1kaur Wrote:
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> leaving cold tap water in a bucket in a bathroom
> all night will result in perfectly cold water in
> the morning (i know this from experience). i
> don't think guru sahib had access to refrigeration
> units, so i seriously doubt we need to refrigerate
> our bath water!


Leaving tap water in a bucket over night might not work because at night during the cold season people put their heater on; thus, the water will adapt and absorb the room temperature as a result it will not be as cold as it should be to keep the person ALERT.
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Are we allowed to love Mirza Ghalib poetry? Veer Ji, that confession may put you in trouble? Were you Amritdhari during this love? Veer Sukhdeep Singh Ji to help please

Vaheguru! When I started liking Ghalib, I was not an Amritdhari but when I learned Urdu, I was an Amritdhari in early years but hadn't yet got pesh in Jatha for Naam DriR. smiling smiley

I did find some Masaaile-Tasavuf in his Kalaam.

I hope its not Peshi time for me. grinning smiley

Kulbir Singh
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Re: Cold showers before amritvela
November 30, 2010 09:09AM
hahah lol .... well that's awesome. i bought some books from amazon. i had a close friend who was from iran and we were always trying to teach each other our languages, it was really fun...i managed to learn some words like donkey, shut the door, how are you? her parents used to laugh because they thought i had perfect pronounciation of the arabic words...it always amused me...

and the other weird thing is...i don't know if this happens to other dastar wearing girls or not..but i am always muslim people walking by and saying assalamalaykum to me LOL...
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Re: Cold showers before amritvela
November 30, 2010 10:29AM
so what did singhs of guru sahib's time do during the summer time? the sarovars at gurdwaras are not cold in summer, neither are the rivers in punjab. and they certainly weren't refrigerating their bath water...

i don't think the instruction for cold water means we must have ice cold water. i think the instruction is so that we don't waste time and resources making warm water, which is a luxury. think about this. in guru sahib's time, if you wanted a hot bath, you'd have to get up, build a fire, heat the water in vessels, then transfer them to your bath. during this time your mind would be focused on the luxury of maya, instead of being focused on naam. on the other hand, to take a "cold" bath, one simply wakes up and jumps into the water, whatever temperature it may be, and focuses on naam. in other words, i don't think the "cold" part is what we should be obsessing about. the idea is to live a simple life, free of excess luxuries, focused on naam.

even bhai sahib randhir singh marveled at how cold the water was in the himalayas. if he'd been refrigerating his bath water, he wouldn't have found it so different, right?
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This thread is totally hilarious! I laughed a lot while reading it, especially the MILK CARTONS!? LOL and Bhai Jaspreet Singh Jee's signature hahaha. The photo of the balti was very funny, this is exactly how I have ishnaan. cool smiley
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Quote

and the other weird thing is...i don't know if this happens to other dastar wearing girls or not..but i am always muslim people walking by and saying assalamalaykum to me LOL...
This happens to Singhs as well. I grew up in the United Arab Emirates, and lived there as an Amritdhari from 2004-2007 as well. There have been enough instances (for me personally) of Arabs, Iranians and Pakistanis (especially Pakistani Punjabis) being more respectful towards Sikhs as compared to most Indians.Once there was an Arab cop at an airport check point in Dubai who saw me and start singing the Daler Mehndi song.
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Re: Cold showers before amritvela
November 30, 2010 12:57PM
so should i say salaam back to them? i did say it to my muslim friends lol....
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Mehtab Singh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Daas had Arabic in school for 9 years and because
> of that I can read Urdu (a bit slowly) as well.
> Sri Jaap Sahib has loads of Arabic words.


Veer Ji If you have time could you please write all the Arabic words in Jaap Sahib along with their meanings?
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1kaur Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> so what did singhs of guru sahib's time do during
> the summer time? the sarovars at gurdwaras are
> not cold in summer, neither are the rivers in
> punjab. and they certainly weren't refrigerating
> their bath water...
>
> i don't think the instruction for cold water means
> we must have ice cold water. i think the
> instruction is so that we don't waste time and
> resources making warm water, which is a luxury.
> think about this. in guru sahib's time, if you
> wanted a hot bath, you'd have to get up, build a
> fire, heat the water in vessels, then transfer
> them to your bath. during this time your mind
> would be focused on the luxury of maya, instead of
> being focused on naam. on the other hand, to take
> a "cold" bath, one simply wakes up and jumps into
> the water, whatever temperature it may be, and
> focuses on naam. in other words, i don't think
> the "cold" part is what we should be obsessing
> about. the idea is to live a simple life, free of
> excess luxuries, focused on naam.
>
> even bhai sahib randhir singh marveled at how cold
> the water was in the himalayas. if he'd been
> refrigerating his bath water, he wouldn't have
> found it so different, right?


I have suggested Leafy to refrigerate the water because she said she cant take a shower like the rest of us. Im not suggesting this was the method during Guru Sahibs time. I would also like to mention using a bucket of water that has been placed over night was not the method as well.

According to Gurmat Maryada the water must be cold and fresh ( refer to Bhai Nand Lal Ji and Prem Sumarg rehanama). By sealing cold water in a bottle the water stays cold and fresh. This does not happen with a non-concealed bucket of cold water that is placed in room temperature. In the old days it would not be so hard to get warm water. All they would have to do is store some water in a room and eventually it will get warm. But this would make the water stale and wont have the effect of making the person more alert during Ishnaan. Purpose of cold water has nothing to do with luxury it has more to do with waking the person up and getting the persons attention on Naam during Amrit Vela.

Your comment about cold water for the purpose of not indulging in luxury reminds me of a funny story. I was once talking to a Singh about cold Ishnaan and I referred to Bhai Nand Lal Jis rehatnama, and he replied" I dont think that rehatnama is authentic. Most likely it was written during the British Raj when the Sikhs were indulging in too much luxuries and straying from a simple life" lol. People will find any excuse to deny Guru Sahibs hukum.
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Don't even get me started on some of the kind of so-called "Rehitnaamey" I have read on some websites grinning smiley . Trust me you will be more than just shocked, and I bet you will make every effort to prove that none of those so-called "Rehitnaamey" are authentic grinning smiley
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Re: Cold showers before amritvela
November 30, 2010 04:26PM
sorry, i just found the idea of putting bath water in the fridge hilarious and absurd. i don't think it's fair to compare that to someone denying panth approved writings like those of bhai nand lal jee.

if bhai nand lal jee said to put our bath water in the fridge, i'm sure we'd all do it. smiling smiley
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Re: Cold showers before amritvela
November 30, 2010 06:07PM
moving onwards from my problem....
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1kaur Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> sorry, i just found the idea of putting bath water
> in the fridge hilarious and absurd. i don't think
> it's fair to compare that to someone denying panth
> approved writings like those of bhai nand lal
> jee.
>
> if bhai nand lal jee said to put our bath water in
> the fridge, i'm sure we'd all do it. smiling smiley


If you know any other method to provide fresh and cold water (as stated by Gurmat Maryada) to someone who cant use a shower head and does not have easy access to a lake or river then please provide your solution. I have simply given Leafy a temporary solution which is within the confines of Gurmat Maryada. Sorry if you dont agree with this solution.
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If indeed some really need very cold water for ishnaan and believe the water suply to their house is not "cold enough" .
Why not just throw ice cubes into the bucket containing the bath water & stir for 1 minute?
add more ice if you want it colder winking smileywinking smileywinking smiley

But, refrigerating your bath water?
holy!eye popping smiley

Chota veer
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MB Singh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I was prompted to learn Urdu out of love for Urdu
> poetry, particularly poetry of legendary Urdu poet
> - Mirza Ghalib.
>
> Are we allowed to love Mirza Ghalib poetry? Veer
> Ji, that confession may put you in trouble? Were
> you Amritdhari during this love? Veer Sukhdeep
> Singh Ji to help please.smiling bouncing smiley smiling bouncing smiley smiling bouncing smiley


Lol Veer Ji its funny that you ask this question. I have a relative who is a Sikh and is very fond of reading poetry
by Bulleh Shah. I told my cousin that he should not recite his poetry because Bullesh Shah had no rehat he was drunkard. I told my cousin that GUru Sahib has already given us esteemed Gurmukh poets like Bhai Nand Lal Ji and Bhai Gurdas both whom have had a high code of conduct. My cousin was quite angered with my statements. I know another Veer Ji in which it seemed like he was getting into poetry by Rumi, and he try to prevent him from doing so but I dont think he was interested in listening to the reason why we should refrain from such degenerate writings.

I dont see any harm in study poetry of people belonging to other faiths for educational reasons. But a Gursikh should never get lost or so much into these poems. It goes against Gurmat to do so. We have to remember many Sufi poets like Mizra Ghalib, Bulleh Shah, Mansur al-Hallaj , and Rumi believe in teachings similar to Advaitat mat. Similar to the Hindu slogan Sohang ( I am God) they get to a point where they eventually say Anā l-Ḥaqq ( I am God) and many of their writings discreetly indicate that they think they are God. For this reason I find their writings boring, depressing, and anti Gurmat. I have not read original verses by Sufi poets but I have heard them speak and read translations and it seems like they confuse their atma with paramatma. If they get darshan of their atma they think have darshan of Paramatma and they then start to think they are paramatma.

Bhai Nand Lal Ji also mentions how the Iraq sufi poet "Mansur al-Hallaj " lost the wine from the bottle - meaning that his ego got so big that he started thinking he was God and lost the tat ( true essence of God). As Gursikhs we have to keep a safeguard so we the wine ( Amrit Ras) doesnt spill from the bottle by our Ego. I believe this is the essence and secret of keeping Bibek . Getting too much into Advaitat poetry by Sufi poets , Hindu Poets or "Gursikh" poets for that matter is damaging to a Gursikhs spirituality.
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uh can this thread now end lol?
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Re: Cold showers before amritvela
December 02, 2010 06:30PM
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ਠੰਡੇ ਪਾਣੀ ਜੋ ਨਹਿ ਨ੍ਹਾਵੈ ਬਿਨ ਜਪ ਪੜ੍ਹੇ ਪ੍ਰਸਾਦ ਜੁ ਖਾਵੈ ॥
thanddae paanee jo nehi nhaavai bin jap parrhae prasaadh j khaavai ||
Those who do not take their morning bath in cold water and those who eat before their Nitnem infringe the Rehat.

Rehatnama Bhai Nand Laal Jee

www.sikhitothemax.com
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I agree with Veer Sukhdeep Singh jee's thoughts on spiritual poetry written by Sufi poets. Sufism has been influenced by Advaita to some extent and Gurmat is not in agreement with Advaita.

Having said that, I don't think Bulleh Shah, Shah Hussain etc. subscribed to Advaitic thoughts. Sufism has many branches and two main branches are - Vahdatul Vajood and Vahdatul Shavood. Only one of these branches subscribes to the Advaita thought.

Still, as you wrote, for study purpose it is okay to read other religions texts including spiritual poetry but we should not fall in love with their poetry. As the matter of fact, a Gursikh who falls in love with Gurbani can never fall in love with any other text - poetry or prose. Gurbani is "baania sirr baani".

Kulbir Singh
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