doing bujjar kurehets on purpose, then asking for pesh...

i have seen a lot of girls lately are doing permanent removal of facial kes, after amrit, then going for pesh. also some girls do it just before amrit, then ask for amrit.

to me, this seems like "cheating" the system. should these girls be allowed to be given amrit? there was a time when panj piyaras would deny amrit to those who did not show enough dedication. is this done now, or is amrit given to just everyone?

what about peshi, do we allow everyone to pesh, no matter what their kurehet? surely these girls should be given some extreme punishment... but we don't see that happening, instead we see more and more girls going for this beadbi. should these girls be allowed to do seva of gursikhs, even after peshi? it seems strange to see girls doing keertan seva in guru sahib's dastaar, with tiny threads of eyebrows...

i know is shouldn't be judgmental of my sisters... but i just can't understand how someone can skate around guru sahib's hukam so easily, then turn around and be readmitted to the khalsa panth. i mean, if kes katal is so easy for these people, then what other hukam is easy to break?

sorry to rant, i'm just a bit frustrated about this.

to be clear, i'm not talking about singhnia who did laser hair treatment long before amrit and then felt sorry for it afterwards. i know a couple of these singhnia and they're very sincere and really regret what then did before they began following sikhi.

i just mean the ones who purposely do it right before amrit, trying to get around the rehet.

Great thinking penjee 1kaur, I've never never people 'cheat' like you stated. It is something to think about for all. It is clearly wrong and a bujjer kurehat.

If he/she as done it intentionally then gone pesh straight after, they do you really think the seed will sprout and blossom like it should? Bhai rama singh jee stated one should prepare the field by doing as much BaNee before amrith especially Mool Mantra.


What you wrote about selecting worthy candidates is very important, there is a sakhi of Bhai Fauja Singh Shaheed getting rejected for Amrit.

Bhai Sahib went inside the amrith sanchaar which was taking place at Ludhiana. The Panj Pyareh the physical roop of Satguru jee were colored in divine Naam, there faces had a mystical shining glow. They asked Bhai Sahib jee some tough questions, they did not even see him as a worthy candidate! They then told him to lye on a train track, if you wish to play the game of love with Satguru jee, do you really want to step on this path? Bhai sahib laid on the train track, a train was fasting approaching, the Sevadaar seeing the oncoming then untied Bhai Sahib from the track. From this the sevadaar knew then that Bhai Sahib was ready to give HIS HEAD to Guru Sahib jee. He then was blessed with amrith at the next amrith sanchaar and became a Fearless Naam Abhyassi who did great parchaar.

All Jathabandi that do Seva in terms of Amrith Sanchaar need to be very harsh in terms of choosing candidates. Unfortunately now, it is given to anyone. The persons state of mind and commitment is not tested. This needs to be enforced back.

This is an important issue that Bhain jee has brought up. Ultimately, Guru Sahib knows everything and whatever we sow, we would reap. If someone is doing chalaaki (cleverness) with Guru Sahib by permanently removing hair just before Amrit Chhak, then that's the kind of reward they will get from Guru Sahib. In olden days, the Gurmukhs doing sewa in Punj Pyare were Antarjaami and as thus could tell what was in the mind of the seeker. They were able to reject the candidates because they could see the hearts of new candidates like an open book.

From this, old memories have been revived. A Singh who played a crucial role in bringing me to Sikhi used to narrate the story of his Amrit Chhak. Before taking Amrit, he used to drink liquor regularly. He made up his mind to take Amrit but one day before taking Amrit he got drunk heavily and drank liquor to his full capacity. He wanted to drink for the last time because he knew he could never drink again and indeed the next day after taking Amrit, he never looked back and was an excellent Singh. Later on he was blessed with Shaheedi by Guru Sahib.

Coming back to the issue, I agree with Bhain jee that people who try to be over smart with Guru Sahib cannot get anywhere spiritually but the main problem is the implementation. Normally, Punj Pyare don't ask for any sins done prior to taking Amrit. What one does prior to Amrit does not concern the Punj so long as one agrees to not commit those sins after Amrit Chhak.

Guru Sahib knows better.

Daas,
Kulbir Singh

Without Amrit there is no Mukhti for a Gursikh. Saying that I think it would be unfair to deny someone to take Amrit or pesh because of a poor decision they made in the past. They already have to look at their face in their mirror every day and see the beadbi they have committed. ISnt that a big enough punishment?

WHen Raja Janak passed through hell he saw the people screaming and being severely punished. Yet he had the compassion to overlook their short comings and show mercy on to them. Panj Pyaarey who are the embodiment of GUru Sahib also display great compassion. They do not take into consideration the previous misdeeds of a person when giving or regiving Amrit instead they look at the potential of the candidate. If the person is worthy to take Amrit and if the person shows willingness to want to live by the tenants of the SIkh faith. It doesnt matter if the person was a pimp, prostitute, murderer, molester, etc . If the person has changed and is willing to further change such people can not be denied that which gives the atma liberation. Guru Sahib has showed us this through example when he blessed the man eater Kauda Raakash with Gurmat Naam. Besides Guru Sahib, nobody is perfect and we all make mistakes so its unfair to reject someone due to their poor thinking because without Gurmat everyone makes bad decisions. Denying a Bhenji amrit due to kes beadbi is like denying a Veer Ji Amrit because he got a tattoo or ear pierced or denying someone who has a beer belly. As Kulbir Singh Veer Ji mentioned I dont think Panj Pyaarey look at the physical body of the candidate. Instead they look at the heart ( intentions) of the candidate. If someone really regrets their misdeeds they should not be denied to take Amrit or pesh

sukhdeep veerji, it's the intention that i'm talking about. more and more young women are going for laser hair removal with the intent of taking amrit immediately after. it's not something they feel bad about, it's something they do so they can get away with it, because they don't love the perfect form waheguru gave them!

we have all seen or heard of singhs going for pesh and coming out with blackened face and hands tied and paraded before sangat. we have heard of singhs being beaten with shoes. if a singhni does permanent kes beadbi KNOWING she can pesh and everything will be forgiven, shouldn't she be subject to the same harsh punishments as singhs?

i'm not talking about a girl plucking her eyebrows once and then feeling bad. i'm talking about purposely doing permanent hair removal because they know they won't be allowed to do plucking/waxing in the future. it's like cheating amrit. and it's becoming more and more common. panj piyaras are guru roop. surely there must be a way for them to tell who is sincerely sorry and who just wants to look fashionable?

guru sahib's amrit is a blessing, it's not a right. we need to remember this.

If she's going in to take amrit for the first time, then unless any of the Panj are Anatarjami, it would be hard to deny the seeker Amrit. But if they somehow find out that she has done so, then I don't think she should be accepted as a suitable candidate for Amrit.

I think people these days don't take Amrit seriously enough. They think its literally the first step, and right after they take amrit their magically going to be able to get up for amritvela and stop the lifestyle they were living before. Out of all the younger Amritdhari people I know, only about 5% of them keep amritvela or even attempt to . But one needs to practice , one must prepare to give the ultimate sacrifice of giving their head to Guru Sahib. If a day, or week or even month before this Bibi decided to remove her hair permanently before the Amrit Sinchar, what makes you think that right after shes going to magically fall in love with Guru Sahib, and live a proper Gursikhi Jeevan. She should have to wait a while, and contemplate what she did

1kaur Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> sukhdeep veerji, it's the intention that i'm
> talking about. more and more young women are
> going for laser hair removal with the intent of
> taking amrit immediately after. it's not
> something they feel bad about, it's something they
> do so they can get away with it, because they
> don't love the perfect form waheguru gave them!
>
> we have all seen or heard of singhs going for pesh
> and coming out with blackened face and hands tied
> and paraded before sangat. we have heard of
> singhs being beaten with shoes. if a singhni does
> permanent kes beadbi KNOWING she can pesh and
> everything will be forgiven, shouldn't she be
> subject to the same harsh punishments as singhs?
>
>
> i'm not talking about a girl plucking her eyebrows
> once and then feeling bad. i'm talking about
> purposely doing permanent hair removal because
> they know they won't be allowed to do
> plucking/waxing in the future. it's like cheating
> amrit. and it's becoming more and more common.
> panj piyaras are guru roop. surely there must be
> a way for them to tell who is sincerely sorry and
> who just wants to look fashionable?
>
> guru sahib's amrit is a blessing, it's not a
> right. we need to remember this.


Bhenji the biggest punishment that a Gursikh receives is having a blackened face in Guru Sahibs court. Those sisters that have done kesh beadbi have already automatically received a blackened face in Guru Sahibs court. It will take much hard work and effort to remove this blackness from their face so they can once again shine in Guru Sahibs court. Naam Abhyiaas, seva ( washing dishes) and years of Joria Seva helps wipe out the blackness from such a face. I dont think whipping or hitting someone with shoes will help them realize their mistake. I think this punishment is usually for people who commit adultery etc. Kesh is the symbol of Sikhi and Guru Sahib. The Kesh keeps a person in high spirits. Those people who pluck their kesh they will have to live with this shame for the rest of their life. To me that is the highest punishment a Gursikh can have. To look in the mirror everyday and know you disrespected Guru Sahib. It will take much years of Joria Seva for the guilt and shame to be removed.

I understand your point that nowadays the punishment for committing a kurehit is quite lenient. Its often the case where the person must recite extra bani which seems more like a reward then a punishment. I think it would be best if their was monetary fines. In addition , it would be good if the peshi was told to do some type of seva that will help them realize the transgression they have committed.The money from monetary fines can be used for GUrmat Parchar and the seva will help the peshi get back to a spiritual state.

VAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA, VAHEGURU JI KI FATEH

My personal vichaar.

Sangat Ji, Amrit is the opening of the door of Gursikhi jeevan. You enter, start to attend class (Simran, Paath, Nitnem, Amrit Vela, Seva, etc.) and move in your spiritual classes. Some move up, others stagnate (minimum maryada, lip service to Gurmat/Gurbani) or fail out (bujjar kureheit). The teacher has given the homework and study material (Gurbani, Rehat, History, Sangat) and the student must attend to his/her studies. Some misfits (like myself) progress little if any. This is not a human teacher. Guru Sahib is the teacher, who knows all - do you think he does not know of his student's capabilities? If a human teacher is able to grasp the competence of a student, surely this knower of all would? Heck, even the grading standards were provided to you in the very study material you have (Rehat is a ksvati of a Gursikh, Gurbani/Gurmat/Gurmat the paaras that changes a manmukh to Gurmukh). Much as in school, the task is to move yourself up in grades. Some are judged to be very capable and granted admission to advanced classes (stricter Maryada, tougher standards), but the teacher is so merciful that he gives easier classes (less tough Maryada) - maybe if they are given a chance, they will excel and catch up. Maybe the classmates (Sangat) will encourage him/her. Maybe helping his elder classmates (Seva) will help give him perspective. The all knowing teacher knows and opens his arms to all to attend.

The teacher is every merciful. Where in the worldly schools, the teacher would expel flunkies (bujjar kureheits), this most merciful teacher will allow one to be re-admitted again to try again for many times over. Such is the nature of his mercy. But upon expulsion, the earned study is lost and must be restarted.

Why worry about whether the punishment is severe enough or not? We are sometimes so worried that the teacher did not slap his student hard enough or scold thoroughly enough (tankah). The ever knowing parent-teacher knows what student needs what sort of punishment. A true student (Pooran Gursikh) is scared to death that he/she will not attend graduation - be one with the Almighty. He/she takes full advantage to complete his/her coursework on time and graduate. It is flunkies like me who procrastinate, get failing grades and don't pay attention. Little do I know that the punisher - Dharam Raaj - is NOWHERE near as merciful as my teacher. Then true punishment will be exacted. Its description is also in my course materials, but as I am lazy and do not pay attention to it, fools like me are not shudder at the thought of what maybe. The true students (Gursikhs) are little worried about Dharam Raaj - to them, the greater fear is that they will disappoint the teacher and not be able to graduate.

Sigh...Guru Kirpa Karan. Sorry for the rambling.

P.S. Do not ever doubt that the Punj Pyare - Panch Pardhani Guru Roop - is unaware of things. An elder Gursikh narrated an incident in which a seemingly Gursikh saroop Bibi went to test the Punj Pyare. Outwardly appearing to be a Gursikh, she presented herself in front of the Punj Pyare, upon which Guru Roop Punj Pyare snapped back and said to NEVER EVER test the Punj Pyare and was told to leave immediately. She decided to test the Punj Pyare by not wearing a Kachera to see if they would know. Guru Sahib is quite aware, as life experiences show/will show each of us.