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Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji Saroop in other languages

Posted by MB Singh 
Waheguru JI Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji KI Fateh

Sangat Jee

We will all agree that Gurbani and its messages should reach, each part of the world, overcoming the language barriers. Translations as well as transliterations are available in some languages and should be there in other languages, as per requirements. All efforts are welcome regarding that.

But do you agree that Guru Sahib saroop (All Saroop in single Volume) be composed in other languages? Does any Veer Ji / Bhein Ji knows about availability of Guru Sahib saroop in other languages, e.g.Sindhi, Spanish? Is there any proposal by some institutions about that? If it happens or if it is there already; should that be acceptable as per Gurmat Bibek? Is there any directive from Akal Takhat about that?

Dhanwaad Ji.
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MB Singh
But do you agree that Guru Sahib saroop (All Saroop in single Volume) be composed in other languages?

When we already know that 'Padched' Swaroop (in Gurmukhi) itself is not acceptable, then the question of using other language (or 'Lipi') should not arise.

Moreover, there are many other concerns, such as 'Vyakaran' and pronunciations of nasal and other sounds etc..., which may not be available in other languages.

Bhul Chuk Maaf.

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa,
Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh.
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I find this video, regarding my search.

[www.youtube.com]
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With translations we should be careful, because throughout our history we have lost a lot of historical and direct literature either by outsiders taking and destroying the originals, or by our own doing. If anyone is going to be making a translation of Gurbani, it should be approved by Punj Pyare at the very least, especially since the fact that prachar is extremely limited as it is. In the past, Gursikhs used to have a vidyia period, where people from the same age as school kids would start learning about Sikh principles. Also anyone who wishes to translate Gurbani should already be well respected by the Panth, even though the creation of the first Pad Ched saroop was by Bhai Mani Singh, he was still condemned for it.

The first Non-Punjabi Saroop written by Baba Deep Singh Ji, and it was made for educational purposes, and to be learned from. So my view is, be careful with translations.
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Thank you, Veer Ji, Jacfsing2 and Jaskirat Singh Ji. As you say, that one non gurmukhi saroop, was written by Baba Deep Singh Ji, that seems quite informative for me. I never knew about that. Do we have enough evidence for that? Because, those who are preparing translations and transliterations in different languages, also have the similar logic. As the lady above in video, is also reciting, in a similar way as we do Sri Sehaj Path. If Baba Deep Singh Ji have already done that; how we can say that this is something wrong and undesired.

May be Veer Kulbir Singh, will share his views or Sangat views about this. I am quite astonished that how a very important topic, is not discussed at Panthic level.

Jaskirat Singh, I also have similar feelings as you. Why not translations and transliterations are restricted by a directive, not to be compiled in a single GRANTH.

Waheguru..
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We need not go too far. During Guru Sahib's time, many languages (Lipi) were already present. Still Guru Sahib created Gurmukhi alphabets and compiled Sri Aad-Granth in Gurmukhi. Dasam Granth, Sarbloh Granth, all are in Gurmukhi Ladivaar.

Are we considering ourself more intelligent than Guru Sahib ?

Maharaaj's swaroop has to be in Ladivaar Gurmukhi only. At the minimum, think about why we have Bani of 'Bavan Akhari'. Mahima of each Gurmukhi Akhar is explained in it.

The translations, transliterations, etc ... should only be used for the purpose of Prachaar. It is not given Gurta-Gaddhi and should not be done Mattha-Tek.

Do Ardas and ask Akaal Purakh to save you from falling prey to this Maha-Manmat.

Bhul Chuk Maaf.

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa,
Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh.
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jaskirat Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> We need not go too far. During Guru Sahib's time,
> many languages (Lipi) were already present. Still
> Guru Sahib created Gurmukhi alphabets and compiled
> Sri Aad-Granth in Gurmukhi. Dasam Granth, Sarbloh
> Granth, all are in Gurmukhi Ladivaar.
>
> Are we considering ourself more intelligent than
> Guru Sahib ?
>
> Maharaaj's swaroop has to be in Ladivaar Gurmukhi
> only. At the minimum, think about why we have Bani
> of 'Bavan Akhari'. Mahima of each Gurmukhi Akhar
> is explained in it.
>
> The translations, transliterations, etc ... should
> only be used for the purpose of Prachaar. It is
> not given Gurta-Gaddhi and should not be done
> Mattha-Tek.
>
> Do Ardas and ask Akaal Purakh to save you from
> falling prey to this Maha-Manmat.

I don't know much about what we should or not do Mehta Tekh to, but Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Arian Dev Ji once bowed to the Chupal worn by his first form, so that should say something. Another thing to note is only a descandant of Baba Buddha has ever put Tilak on the light of Vaheguru for Gurgaddi. (Accidentally clicked post message twice).
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"""Another thing to note is only a descandant of Baba Buddha has ever put Tilak on the light of Vaheguru for Gurgaddi.""""""
Veer Ji, will u please further clarify that point.
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MB Singh Wrote:
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> """Another thing to note is only a descandant of
> Baba Buddha has ever put Tilak on the light of
> Vaheguru for Gurgaddi.""""""
> Veer Ji, will u please further clarify that point.


In the Prakash of Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji, nobody put a tilak on him, and he was made Guru, (so no Tilak). From the Gurugaddi of Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Angad Dev Ji to Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Hargobind Ji, Baba Buddha himself put the tilak on the next Guru. Sadly, when we've lost lots of literature when Indian government attacked Harmandir Sahib, as well as our own Sikhs destroying our own ithiaas from Mahants and our own doings, so the Gur-gaddi of Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Har Rai to Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Tegh Bahadur Ji aren't well recorded with who put the Tilak. However Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji's Gurgaddi had a descandant of Baba Buddha put the tilak by the name of Baba Ram Kanwar.
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With all due respect, question is that are we trying to meet Vaheguru & helping others to spread almighty word or we are just limited within our own boundaries. Jo prab ko mil........................khoj shabad me leh..............................

Guru Granth Sahib Jee is limitless & more powerful than we can ever understand with our limited understanding.

Have faith in Guru Granth Sahib Jee and treat Guru as Guru in all forms.

Treat Guru Granth sahib jee with respect from the core of your heart, no talking in front of Guru and listen and learn, amazing things will happen. If you love Guru, you will receive twice the love back.

Please forgive.
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sevak
Have faith in Guru Granth Sahib Jee and treat Guru as Guru in all forms.

If we go by this logic then I don't think the day is too far when, in the name of Faith and Respect, one would do Prakash of some Gurbani Android App and put Rumalla Sahib on Desktop Monitor or on Smartphone and start doing Chaur Sahib on it.

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sevak
or we are just limited within our own boundaries.

Following ਰਿਵਾਯਿਤ, ਉਸੂਲ, and ਰਿਹਿਤ does not mean living within limited boundaries. How much fruit the open boundaries of Yogi Bhajan, Radha Swami, Nirankaris, Deravaad etc... have bore that we all very well know. Doing Prakash of translation or transliteration is going to become new Deravaad.

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sevak
Treat Guru Granth sahib jee with respect from the core of your heart, no talking in front of Guru and listen and learn, amazing things will happen. If you love Guru, you will receive twice the love back.

ਪ੍ਰੇਮ ਪਦਾਰਥ ਅਤੇ ਪ੍ਰਭੂ ਦੀ ਪ੍ਰਾਪਤੀ ਸ਼ਰ੍ਧਾ ਕਰਕੇ ਨਹੀ ਬਲਕਿ ਗੂੜੀ ਭਗਤੀ ਕਰਕੇ ਹੁੰਦੀ ਹੈ | ਏ ਬਾਬਤ ਰਹੇ ਕੀ ਬਿਨਾ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰ ਤੇ ਭਗਤੀ ਹੋਣੀ ਅਸਂਭਵ ਹੈ | ਕਿਸੀ ਵੀ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰ ਦਾ ਨਿਰਮਾਣ ਸਖਤ ਉਸੂਲਾਂ ਤੋ ਹੁੰਦਾ ਹੈ |

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sevak
& helping others to spread almighty word

ਦਾਸ ਦਾ ਫੁਰਨਾ ਏ ਹੈ ਕੀ ਪ੍ਰਚਾਰ ਦਾ ਅਧਿਕਾਰ ਸਿਰ੍ਫ ਉਸ ਨੂ ਹੋਵੇ ਜਿਸ ਨੇ ਪਿਹਲਾ ਆਪ ਸਚ ਕਮਾ ਲੇਯਾ ਹੋਵੇ | ਅੱਜ ਕਲ ਤਾਂ ਚਾਰ ਕਿਤਾਬਾਂ ਪੜ ਕੇ ਕੋਈ ਵੀ ਛਾਲ ਮਾਰ ਕੇ ਸ੍ਟੇਜ ਤੇ ਚੜੀ ਬੈਠਾ ਹੈ |



ਜਿਸ ਧਰਮ ਦਾ ਗਯਾਨ ਜਿੰਨਾ ਉਚਾ ਹੁੰਦਾ ਹੈ, ਉਸ ਧਰਮ ਦਾ ਕਾਨੂਨ, ਰਿਹਿਤ, ਉਸੂਲ ਵੀ ਉਂਨੇ ਹੀ ਉਚੇ, ਸਖਤ ਅਤੇ ਕਰੜੇ ਹੋਣ੍ਗੇ |

ਖਾਲਸਾ ਜੀ ਤੁਸੀ Translation ਅਤੇ Transliterations ਕਰ ਕੇ ਗੁਰਬਾਣੀ ਨੂ ਤਾਂ ਪੜ ਲਵੋਗੇ ਪਰ ਗੁਰਬਾਣੀ ਤੋਂ ਨਹੀ ਪੜ ਸਕੋਗੇ |

ਕੀ ਅਸੀ ਗੁਰਬਾਣੀ ਨੂ ਪੜਨਾ ਹੈ ? ਜਾਂ ਫਿਰ ਗੁਰਬਾਣੀ ਤੋ ਪੜਨਾ ਹੈ ? ਜੀਵਨ ਤੁਹਾਡਾ ਹੈ, ਫੈਸਲਾ ਵੀ ਤੁਹਾਡਾ ਹੀ ਹੈ |

ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕਾ ਖਾਲਸਾ,
ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕੀ ਫਤਿਹ |
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Veer ji,
I think I was not talking about ritual, my humble request with my limited intellect was all about Shabad. Well ਗੂੜੀ ਭਗਤੀ happens with faith. Faith comes from Guru kirpa. With Guru kripa comes understanding of Guru bani....rab rakha.


ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕਾ ਖਾਲਸਾ,
ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕੀ ਫਤਿਹ |
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Its a misery, we have not recognized our Guru and its form.

Sri Guru Granth Sahib is Akal Purakh itself in the form of Guru, and as physical embodiment of Guru. Those who have understood this, and bowed to it as if its Akal Purakh sitting on throne as Guru, have been blessed by the naam which came from Sachkhand. And those who got naam, got true profits reading the Gurubaani, as they could perceive meanings inside them and also just reading Gurubani as mantra uplifts them to higher Khands gradually.

So the real power of Sri Guru Granth Sahib is that it holds the authority of naam brought from Sachkhand by Baba Nanak. All Guru Sahibaan did sanchaar of naam by giving Charan Pahul to Sikhs.

Finally, as bestowed by Dasam Paatshah, Sri Guru Granth Sahib holds the power to do sanchaar of this naam today through Punj Pyarey in Amrit Sanchaar done by full maryada enstablished by Dasam Paatshah.

So my friend, just the prakash of Sri Guru Granth Sahib on throne, has power to sow naam in seeker through Punj Pyarey. It is not even being read when it is being done, its just the presence. It means there is a jyot, present there at the time of Amrit Sanchar, Jyot of Guru Sahibaan which delivers naam through Punj Pyaarey.

Same way, just doing Ardaas standing in front of Sri Guru Granth Sahib, is being listened by that jyot, and answered too.

It is a very wrong interpretation that sikhs bow down to knowledge. No, we bow down to the Jyot which is in Sri Guru Granth Sahib. This jyot exists only if the Sri Guru Granth Sahib is in the form in which Guru Sahib gave it to us. It wont be there if we do any alteration with our manmat.

So whether it is translation, transliteration, pad ched, any sort of change in Sri Guru Granth Sahib's baani, will not have jyot. So it cannot give naam. Sanchaar of naam is the only well being of creatures of this world.

THinking of it as book with a text means, you are trying to read a "message" which needs to be followed in lives. This is very Christian way of thinking, like be kind, this all humans as one etc etc etc....just knowing this message wont transform you to that extent, the way naam transforms human to a divine possibility.

We can recall from history how naam made Sikhs super humans. And again, naam is only blessed in a divine setup of Amrit Sanchaar in presence of Sri Guru Granth Sahib in its true form.

So how can translations, transliterations do any good to humanity? Like Bhai Jaskirat Singh pointed, it can just create dummy sikhs like 3HO, nirankaris, derawaads etc, who are devoid of naam and are just going on path of manmattt.

ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕਾ ਖਾਲਸਾ,
ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕੀ ਫਤਿਹ |
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Sevak Veer Ji, above two posts by Jaskirat and Jatinder Singh Ji, correctly (as I think) explain the point in the post. The moment we agree with the idea of accepting any form of Guru as Guru, we appear to miss the JOT concept.

After all, we as Sikhs, share the responsibility of maintaining the correct SARROOP (form) of GURU GRANTH SAHIB for the whole humanity and the our coming generations. Is it not disrespect to authority of AKAAL PURAKH and GURU SAHIB, when we say that any form will be equally acceptable? Is it not like misguiding the humanity, if we do not inform them that the original form of SARROOP is the real form, which is to be worshiped as our ancestors used to worship GURU NANAK DEV SAHIB JI and other nine GURU SAHIB?

No other religion has the SHABAD GURU concept as we have. Neither any religion has the exact words and "Poetry" said or written by their prophets, as Sikhs have. So ours is a bigger responsibility.
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Well with all due respect, its futile to go about arguing about this.

I am not only respecting Guru Granth Sahib jee but also words of our Gurus even written in any other language.

Forgive me if I am wrong.

Jo prabb mere ki baat sunayee so Bhai so mera meet
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Well said Jaskirat Singh Ji and Jatinder Singh Ji! Totally agree with your views.

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Well with all due respect, its futile to go about arguing about this.

I am not only respecting Guru Granth Sahib jee but also words of our Gurus even written in any other language.

Forgive me if I am wrong.

Jo prabb mere ki baat sunayee so Bhai so mera meet

No one is really arguing here. We should humbly accept the viewpoints which are according to Gurmat rather than labeling them as futile arguments. With such attitude towards Gursikhs, we cannot really learn much on the path of Sikhi.
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