When Bhai Sahib tested Certified Scholars and Sampradaee Gianis

Bhai Sahib in his book, Gurbani diya Laga Matra dee Vilakhanta, has written about the importance of Laga Maatra in Gurbani. He has written that the famous scholars of Panth have failed to do correct meanings of Gurbani partly because they did not realize the importance of Laga Maatra of Gurbani.

Below is the translated part from the aforementioned book of Bhai Sahib Randhir Singh jee:

We can say with full conviction that if you take dictation test of the current certified scholars of universities, all of them will fail this test. Even more, the many authoritarians of Gurmat education will also fail this dictation test. We have taken dictation test of many Gianis who had Nitnemi Baanis memorized and many Gianis who do Sampradaee Katha and have taught Santhiya to countless students; we asked them to write the first 5 Pauris of Siri Jap jee Sahib correctly (as far as spellings are concerned) and they all remained below the satisfactory level (i.e. they failed).

Today, you ask them to write such Baani from Siri Guru Granth Sahib jee that they don't have memorized, you will find that they won't be able to write even on Pankiti correctly. Yes, the scribes (writers) of Gurbani in the past or today, surely can write correctly up to some extent.

The above passage shows that Bhai Sahib tested many university scholars and Sampradai Gianis by asking them to write the first 5 Pauris of Siri Jap jee Sahib and all of them failed. Does anyone know when and where Bhai Sahib took this test and which famous scholars and Gianis took part in this test?

It's pretty sad that we don't preserve our history. Many important events of Bhai Sahib's life and even the era around 1984 are not recorded. History and important events of Panth must be preserved for the benefit of the future generations.

Kulbir Singh

Wow... of course moorakhs like me should not anytime try to do rees of Gursikhs but sometime for our own growth we should just try to take this test and see how we do?

I bet I would have very very low score in placing correct lag-maatraan in writing out first five pauris of Japji Sahib from memory.

It's a great test and great reminder of the importance of lag-maatraan.

From doing sangat of Bhagat Jaswant Singh Jee, I have personally seen him test other Gianis and Santhya teachers, to see if they can write atleast one pangati from anywhere in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Jee. Not one person did i see write a single pangti correctly they have always had some laga matar missing.

Thats why Bhagat Ji always stresses to gursikhs to do abyass of muharni and to read gurbani with all the laga matars, in this ways itt is much easier for a gursikh to get all the laga matars memorized and to also visually see them in thier mind, and to always continously do abyaas of gurbani so that they can obstain this avastha.

ਸਲੋਕੁ ||
ਆਏ ਪ੍ਰਭ ਸਰਨਾਗਤੀ ਕਿਰਪਾ ਨਿਧਿ ਦਇਆਲ ||
ਏਕ ਅਖਰੁ ਹਰਿ ਮਨਿ ਬਸਤ ਨਾਨਕ ਹੋਤ ਨਿਹਾਲ ||੧||
Bhagat Jaswant Singh Jee has told daas that one time Sant Baba Gurbachan Singh told them on a night when the sky was full of stars. That Vadey Mahapurkh said that as you can see all the stars in the sky, just like that this how daasan daas can see guru sahib bani in thier mind.
Bhagat ji would tell daas and other gursikhs that this is just one of things that we should aim for.

But sadly whenever i tell gursikhs on this forum or inperson about reading bani with laga matar they are never ready to look at the profit that can be obtained from reading gurbani in this manner instead they are just ready start a debate.

Dhan are those gursikhs that have Guru Sahibs bani not just memorized like a tape recorder but also have the laga matars memorized.

Vaaheguru!!

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa, Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh

I have a question with respect to the fact that Bhai Sahib used to conduct test of writing Gurbani, which even some Gaini's would fail.

The question is that how do one memorize the lagamatra(n) which are not pronounced, this would mostly include the aunkad and the sihari at the end?

I was actually figuring out whether good knowledge of Gurbani viakaran would help in this. Hence, the following thought:

- A person who is well versed in gurbani viakaran, would have to actually/physically look at the pankti written and only then derive its meaning based on viakaran.
- But for someone to only hear a pankiti and then to write it down with correct laga(n) matra(n), would be possible in two ways only (excluding spiritual powers):
1. The person has the laga(n) matra(n) memorized.
2. The person knows the exact/correct meaning of that pankiti and then would arrive at its laga(n) matra(n) based on the correct meaning. (Reverse Engineering)

- The first is the most obvious way.
- The second way would very difficult except for the pankiti's for which the person is sure of the meanings.
- And based on the above, I feel that knowledge of viakaran works to arrive at the correct meaning of the pankti written down. But it doesn't so much work the other way around.

So, I feel that we would have to memorize the lagamatra(n) to pass Bhai Sahib's tests.

I would request the Sangat to provide their valuable inputs to the above mentioned thought.

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa, Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa, Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh

This is a beautiful thread and indeed Tejasv you have highlighted some real decent suggestions for further thought analysis.

I feel , we as Gursikhs should learn to write word per word Gurbani, copying it on a daily basis till one can pass such a test - starting out with Japji Sahib for example. As Tejasv has stated unless you miraculous spiritual powers what other way could it possible recall and write Gurbani.

I'm not sure if Bhai Sahib Randhir Singh Jee ever suggested for Gursiks to practice writing Gurbani from memory after first just copying it?
However I feel it would be an invalueable exercise - as when you write you connect to your heart 90% of the time, however cannot comment on the experiece as I haven't tried it myself.

Dass is concerned about writing Gurbani on paper unless it is for purpose of preparing a binded saroop or nitnem gutka.

Is it ok to practice on white board as you can rub it off afterwards thus not having to worry about the satkaar for keeping piles of paper with gurbani written on them? Or will rubbing it off the board not be in accordance with Gurmat?