Depression

Sangat jee,

I would really appreciate some advice. What is the Gurmat perspective on dealing with depression? I know that it's a silly question to ask as Guru Sahib says "sarab rog ka akhaud naam", but what if your circumstances are such that you have lost all of your gursikh friends, don't really get a chance at doing sangat, and it feels like by each day your love and understanding of Sikhi is dwindling away?

After being prescribed anti-depressants by my doctor, and not enjoying the side-effects I have opted not to use any wordly medication. I have on a few occassions tried to speak to gursikhs I thought would try to help or understand, but was left feeling more alone than before I asked for their help. I guess there's a huge stigma associated with depression and no one really wants to deal with it.

I feel like it's a huge hindrance in my life, like a dark cloud that blocks my usual care-free and happy nature.

I think the words of Gurmukhs who are living, breathing examples of gurbaanee would be priceless for me in this situation.

Many thanks in advance.

My friend,

I have gone through your situation many times and what has worked for me is the following:

1. Daily recitations of Sri Sukhmani Sahib Jee, Sri Dukh Bhanjan Jee, and Salok M9.
2. Do Mool Mantar Jaap

I have been struggling with depression since childhood and the best medicine for me is what I described above.

Also, the following also works for me as well (but is not related to Gurmat)

1. Go for a walk or do some light exercise
2. Do something you enjoy and make some time for fun in your life. This will keep your life in balance.


Bhul Chuk Maaf

wahe guru ji ka khalsa waheguru ji ki fateh.____/ \____

After listening to a couple of gursikhs from my family who have gone through this feeling of "depression".They all answered that they did the same thing (as 1 of the gurmukh described above).They were all nitnemi.but at the stage of depression they spended more time in meditating .They attended more kirtan darbaars to divert their mind from the reason of depression,and did the uncountable numbers of jaap of "mool mantar".

bhul chuk maaf ..anjaan bacche samaj ke khima kar dena ji.

yeah antidepressants are not good. they supress your emotions and you are not able to release them and they just make you numb.

do simran, and keep praying to God. antidepressants are not good at all, infact very bad, psychiatrists are not my favourites......alot of them are just in the profession to make easy money and label people.

Sometimes having to let go off of certain thoughts, feelings and emotions is just the best option. Sometimes things just don't work out the way you want them to be. Although unwilling and not wanting to, we just have to *forget* and move on. What more can be said???

but what if
> your circumstances are such that you have lost all
> of your gursikh friends, don't really get a chance
> at doing sangat, and it feels like by each day
> your love and understanding of Sikhi is dwindling
> away?
>


Look, friends are only friends with you because of some kind of happiness/benefit they can achieve from being with you, once they get no happiness or whatever they want from you - off they leave. It is only really rare true friends that stick with you through thick and thin, those friends are rare to find. Most friends want something and only for a certain time.

Family sticks with you more than friends....rely on your family....more than family is Guru Sahib/God...there comes even times when your family will leave you too...you would be all alone, but GOD never leaves you. He is ALWAYS there. Don't hope to find true happiness from people, just rely on God.

It says in rehraas sahib that janan pita lok sut banata, koi na kis ki dharaya...sir sir rizak sambahe thakur kar tal tarayaa. so remember God always cos if you remember God through happiness and sadness/depression God will take care of you Himself. You don't need to rely on anyone, no one gives anyone anything, God gives everything to everyone according that persons karmas and destiny.

So take the medicine of the Lord's name and let it be. What goes around comes does come back around, maybe even 10 times more.

Sometimes things happen in life to make your faith grow in God. If anything unfortunate happens in your life, consider it a gift from waheguru cos it is. Rely on nobody else to for support. Forget about friends, focus on your family. If your family memebers are not dependable or nice to you, Focus on yourself and WAHEGURU. He will make make everything better for you and you will get even better than what you think was worth alot to you then, you will soon come to realise that waheguru had better plans for you. Don't worry, be happy and be thankful to God always.

Do japji sahib's paths becos Jap ji is a bani that strengthens you mind. Do Jaap Sahib as it is completely composed of the praises of the Lord. There are a couple of shabads you can sing/recite that will help you. There is some kind of a shabad for every kind of situation in life that will give you strength to carry on - search the Amrit Kirtan pothi and find those shabads.

Goodluck, may God BLESS you

According to the principles of natural health the mind defines a base in the body organic matter and chemical processes. A long term negative state of mind creates a firm base in the matter and process of the body. In simple words the body becomes toxic. This makes it all the more difficult for the mind to become free from the negative state which now has a material sustenance. To do this deep cleansing is required. Know the important truth that the body reflects in mind and mind reflects in the body.

- Start by taking a deep look into what you eat. There is knowledge around if one looks for it. If one is not inclined towards it, it is sufficient to know that raw fruits and vegetables are the secret to restoration, cleaning and healing.

- Improvement of blood flow to all parts of the body serves the very important purpose of cleaning of body of the depression counterparts in the processes and organic matter. This is achieved by moderate exercise which involves all the joints. Pranayama can help a lot in supplying ample oxygen which helps removes all the toxins.

Ultimate sahara is of Naam and Gurbani, All our efforts bear fruit due to His Grace.

Gursikhs are always faced to some sort of Exam by Guru Pita jee,to keep us moving and be focused on One the True. Indeed there is some hardship to get along with it.But,don't worry he'll carry you across with caring!

Depression is a very common problem for most of Gursikhs,when your new to Sikhi in this dark age of Kalyug. Especially, whenever there is failure,there is depression to some extent. Believe me, we all long for Sangat each and every second, unfortunately, we do have to face hardship to be blessed with it.

I have come across many cases of depression within last few years and one of them was so outrageous.i.e. he attacked 1-2 non-sikhs under the darkness of hume,thinking of served his duty. Though,he is a innocent,calm and caring for everybody in actual.

here are some useful tips that actually worked out in my personal experience with people :
1. You need to understand that what the Depression,actually is.
2. What are those concerns that makes you feel depressed.
3. " Keeping emotions in youself" and being "emotional" are opposite. One leads you to Light,whereas other is fully dark end." Emotional"
is where depression begins. When you possess dreams/things aren't met,you start to feel depressed about them.
4. Always Remember that He may or may not think appropriate for you that your looking for.So let him decide what is better for you than
other.

People who are depressed should read part of Gurbani there Guru Pita ji tells us that Happiness and sadness,success and failure,so called "goodluck and "bad luck" and same goes for Sangat and no-sangat, are like sunlight and shadow Neither one remains forever. Make it your habit that nothing is consistent.Conditions are firm and unbendable Neither for Gurmukh bhagats nor for manmukhs,either we need to get out of Tri-Gun maya or we should expect some troubles coming along our way.

As soon as your Effort is there, then take your Present as his Bhana and thank him for whatever it may be,but, make him realize that you need Sangat and your waiting with folded hands for the time to come in.

Don't get emotional and try to be limited in your dreams and don't put a deadline in front.

Apologies for any mistakes!

I have battled with depression my whole life, best method to face such challenge is to accept and be proud of who you are, your sexual orientation, your acedamic qualifications, your career progress etc hardly have anything related to your spiritual elevation, have full faith in Karma and don't take anything seriously. It's the ego which causes depression, we are so stubborn. Be good to everyone even if that person is mahapaapi, treat animals and nature with full respect.

Yup you ARE what you eat also. So eat healthy.

* Drink atleast 8 cups of water every day (try drinking filtered water)
*Eat fruits/vegetables (organic ones are the best to stick to)
*Pray before you eat
*Only eat when you're really hungry, don't just sit around and eat because it's tasty (That's temptation)
*Eat small meals .......don't eat very spicy meals..keep it plain...
*Take your vitamins...

Don't drink alot of tea like most indians do, drink teas like chammomile and green tea, those are good tasting and help alot in your health,they help you get rid of free radicals in your bloodstream ..remember you need to keep your body healthy because you need your body to pray to God.

What kind of things are you doing in life? Like what are your activities? Do you give 10% of your earnings to help the needy? If not start doing that cause those people will bless you and you would feel happy too, it will make you feel useful that you did something useful for another human/being.

Don't drink junk drinks U(fizzys, juices and all that).....only healthy stuff that detoxifies your body, you could drink that as a medicinal beverage......You could go to health store and find out about detoxification pills, you know like herbal stuff.

Here's a helpful site worth looking at
[www.calmclinic.com]

Hope that helps ya somewhat...don't take antripressants - they will cripple you from within.

Here's a book you could get and read. Tells you about reality of antidepressants, antipsychotic medcations. PLEASE STAY AWAY from them.
I have a dvd which tells about the horror stories of people who were given antidepressants and what happened to them over time. Alot of them committed suicide. These psychiatrists are EVIL people. Believe me, these psychiatrists, alot of them are in it to MAKE MONEY, - they DON'T care what these medicines will do to you. They are very good at convincing people. The BEST MEDICINE is PRAYER. BEST OF THE BEST - PRAY SINCERELY, YOU WILL GET RESULTS VERY QUICKLY.

I'll find where that dvd is and tell you the details of it and you can look it up and buy it yourself and see the reality behind these drugs and what they do to people.

Depression is a state of mind equivalent to HELL. You're living in hell when you are depressed. So do what makes you happy and get out of that hellish state. PRAYER is the only best remedy. Do other activites that you happy. Talk to a friend or whatever that makes you feel better, but make sure the thing you are doing to make you feel better isn't BAD for you ultimately. Some people get into addictions because drugs and things like that (vices) give a temporary relief - so stay away from those.

Good things include like reading a book, cleaning, art, sewing, sports, watching a useful movie, you know things like that...you need to keep a balance, and so then you will feel balanced too. Actively do it, don't just prcrastrinate about it. Get to it, do it right away, just get on with it.

The Wikipedia website states 'procrastination refers to the act of replacing high-priority actions with tasks of lower priority, or doing something from which one derives enjoyment, and thus putting off important tasks to a later time'.

[en.wikipedia.org]

So yes, this is exactly what you're doing right here, you're procrastinating by allowing by feeling bad/low in life because you are DENYING the possibility of a better future for yourself. You have to be positive in life, life is full of so many hurdles, God is continually throwing these tests to make you better. believe me, God does want you to live a good, useful, holy, useful, fruitful life. You have to believe in God completely to let Him give you what you deserve, and if you deserve bad then thank God for that too, think like this 'I must have done something to get this', or if you sincerely think you got a treatment you didn't deserve then resolve it. If it can't be resolved, leave it to God to take care of it. Pray...........get on with your normal life.

check out this post

[gurmatbibek.com]

Also check out this link:

[gurmatbibek.com]

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji KI Fateh

There is lot to learn, from this post. There are woderful thoughts posted.------------I have always been with the feeling, that depression is the disease/problem, which needs curing through GURBANI mainly. I mean, depression is some psychological state of our mind and Gurbani has also to work on our mind. So a minimum level of depression in that sense, is desired to get attached with Gurbani.

I got a chance to read a discussion, where a GURSIKH physician veer ji, also agrees that depression, does need clinical help from experts. This being a subject of medical science, I can not ignore these views, completely. Depression may need clinical intervention, yet we SIKHS of the GURU, may not need it.

I could not understand one point given by Bhawan Gill Veer Ji, -------------------- "Keeping emotions in youself" and being "emotional" are opposite. One leads you to Light, whereas other is fully dark end." Emotional" is where depression begins.

Most of the times, we hear people saying that one should not keep emotions supressed and should vent out emotions for being in good mental health. Will Veer Ji explain the point further. Is being emotional, something not desired?

Look, you do need to vent from time to time, it clears up your system. It serves as a release of build up....let it go...before you burst...

Good way to do that on a regular basis is writing it down. Write it down in a diary or something. that way you are not telling people about it, because people get sick and tired of hearing you vent. They say things like you complain too much blah blah and what not. Noone really understands and when they try telling others, they don't always get sympathy sooooo the best way to go about is it...write it down in a diary/book whatever.

Address it to God...talk to God about it. and then later on if you don't want anyone to find out about it, all you have to do it, rip it up and throw it away, burn it or whatever, that way it stays between you and GOD...and nobody else really needs to know how you feel inside all the time anyways. That way you end up becoming best friends with GOD!!

Sorry I meant janan pita lok sut banita koe na kis ki dharayaa, sir sir rizak sambahe thakur kahe man bhau karayaa - will probably get punished for saying it wrong.

MB Singh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji KI Fateh

> I could not understand one point given by Bhawan
> Gill Veer Ji, -------------------- "Keeping
> emotions in youself" and being "emotional" are
> opposite. One leads you to Light, whereas other is
> fully dark end." Emotional" is where depression
> begins.
>
> Most of the times, we hear people saying that one
> should not keep emotions supressed and should vent
> out emotions for being in good mental health. Will
> Veer Ji explain the point further. Is being
> emotional, something not desired?


Before we can understand the concept behind being "emotional", we need to certain what "a Emotion" actually is? Therefore,we seek sharn of SatGuru Pita jee to search in Gurbani about what Emotion is. What I found is "Bhav+Sagar".

Bhav - is ਭਾਵ or ਭਾਵਨਾ or ਭਾਵਨਾਵਾ or we call Emotions.( there can be many definitions out there,but we don't need to argue anyone)
Sagar- very simple as that - ਸਾਗਰ or Sea.( here in this context it goes for ਭਾਵਨਾਵਾ ਦਾ ਜਲ).

Guru jee has been taking about the people drowning in Bhavsagar and the ways to escape. We need to understand what Guru Pita's call is and Gursikh requires Benti and effort to understand the Gurbani,but, should make sure that we don't want to stuck into only Giyaan or kood Giyaan.

Keeping Emotion - One should keep emotions and so is required to live in this world. Emotion is cause to Daya and Daya is required to be a Sikh.We should keep emotions because people out there can only be living in emotion all the time and if you don't keep emotions then it means you most likely will hurt their feelings and that is not acceptable in Gurmat. Emotions is a sense/condition people live in,therefore, we need sense of Emotion to understand their sentiments.
Being Emotional - Being emotional is when you are under influence of Emotion and you can be very outrageous. "so-called Khalistanes" are example of being emotional within Sikhs or The video in Taksali Sikhs were beating up a old age drunk sikh Nihung. These singhs are actually want to do something better for Sikhi,but "Emotion" drags them to darkside of their job.

Also,Emotion is cause to the impact that Maya haves on us. Whenever we get emotional,no matter if its Religious or worldly,we suffer.

Being "Shy" as well has its black side to much extent and we do have to suffer. It can be worldly suffering to attain something and that definitely have bad impact on our spiritual side of Jeeven.

Emotion is all practical idea in our jeevan and You can better understand them by experiencing.

We should try to find such kinda answers in our selves and Effort in Naam is only way to have these answers.

Hope I addressed your concern!

Guru Sahib surely feels the pain of his children. Most of us don't care, nor do we reciprocate Guru Sahibs compassion. He is our mother. He cherishes all of his children. Ghat ghat key pat pat kee jaaney. I think he feels everyones dukh. If humans have the capacity to feel sad for others than Guru Sahib probably cries for his children... didnt his heart break when the kashmiri pandits came and pleaded for help? Didnt he hold his children tight so many times after they became bemukh and blessed them and brought them back to him and hugged them close and shed tears for them ? I think every time we share our dukh with our Mata jee then his heart must probably melt because he is so soft hearted. He probably blessed every tyrant that ever attacked him. He is the kindest of all. He is the most loving husband we will ever find. He isthe sweetest friend we can ever hope to have. So who should we share our pain with other than him? And we should love him foe the dukh he gives us because he loves us even though we barely carw that he sat on thathee thavee for us, that he blessed us with naam and amrit and that he empowered us and turned us into hawks from sparrows, and we ddon't even care.

Dohaagan I think you should do seva to deal with your depression. The most obvious answer is more naam and bani but if you don't have sharda in that at least engage in something that will keep you active and stop focusing on your self and your problems. Seva of guru sahibs gursikhs is a great way of invoking the kirpa of guru sahib

> Before we can understand the concept behind being
> "emotional", we need to certain what "a Emotion"
> actually is? Therefore,we seek sharn of SatGuru
> Pita jee to search in Gurbani about what Emotion
> is. What I found is "Bhav+Sagar".
>
> Bhav - is ਭਾਵ or ਭਾਵਨਾ or
> ਭਾਵਨਾਵਾ or we call Emotions.( there
> can be many definitions out there,but we don't
> need to argue anyone)
> Sagar- very simple as that - ਸਾਗਰ or Sea.(
> here in this context it goes for
> ਭਾਵਨਾਵਾ ਦਾ ਜਲ).
>

If I may humbly point out the word is ਭਵਸਾਗਰ or ਭਉਸਾਗਰ and not ਭਾਵਸਾਗਰ

ਸਬਦਿ ਗੁਰੂ ਭਵਸਾਗਰੁ ਤਰੀਐ ਇਤ ਉਤ ਏਕੋ ਜਾਣੈ ॥ (SGGS ang 944)
ਜਿਨਿ ਕਿਛੁ ਕੀਆ ਸੋਈ ਜਾਣੈ ਸਬਦੁ ਵੀਚਾਰਿ ਭਉ ਸਾਗਰੁ ਤਰੈ ॥੧॥ (SGGS ang 1342)
ਭਵ ਸਾਗਰ ਬੋਹਿਥ ਹਰਿ ਚਰਣ ॥ (SGGS ang 867)

The word form ਭਵ or ਭਉ stand for ਸੰਸਾਰ / ਜਗਤ and not for emotions.
The compound ਭਵਸਾਗਰ or ਭਵਸਾਗਰ stands for ਸੰਸਾਰ ਸਾਗਰ or sea of worldliness or maya.

ਬੂਡਤ ਸੰਸਾਰ ਸਾਗਰ ॥ ਉਧਰੇ ਹਰਿ ਸਿਮਰਿ ਰਤਨਾਗਰ ॥੧॥ (SGGS ang 1301)

Sumooh pyarey gursikha da dteh dhilo dhanvadh ji. Waheguru ji mehar karan.

The reason,I wrote above post to try to help the people are in Depression. I don't like debate on such topics. It leaves the Victim with more confusion and disappointment. if its was his/her concern, then i don't mind replying back.


Now, Khalsa jee, Your also 100% correct in your thoughts,but you need to pay attention here!

First of all, For me Bhvsagar or Bhavsagar are same; I rather right Bhav but pronounce it as BHV with equal meanings. Also, I have already mentioned that there can be different definitions of BHAVSAGAR out there, I don't argue anyone.

Your talking about that 'we are stuck in Sansar Sagar(in very gurbani context)'.Here is question that what makes us stuck in this ocean?

What I am saying that " Being Emotional" cause you stuck in this ocean or sansar sagar.

I will only elaborate more in deep if the Veer who actually started this thread have any questions or he feels,if it will useful in his context.

thanks!



eyesacademic Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If I may humbly point out the word is
> ਭਵਸਾਗਰ or ਭਉਸਾਗਰ and not
> ਭਾਵਸਾਗਰ
>
> ਸਬਦਿ ਗੁਰੂ ਭਵਸਾਗਰੁ
> ਤਰੀਐ ਇਤ ਉਤ ਏਕੋ ਜਾਣੈ
> ॥ (SGGS ang 944)
> ਜਿਨਿ ਕਿਛੁ ਕੀਆ ਸੋਈ
> ਜਾਣੈ ਸਬਦੁ ਵੀਚਾਰਿ
> ਭਉ ਸਾਗਰੁ ਤਰੈ ॥੧॥ (SGGS
> ang 1342)
> ਭਵ ਸਾਗਰ ਬੋਹਿਥ ਹਰਿ
> ਚਰਣ ॥ (SGGS ang 867)
>
> The word form ਭਵ or ਭਉ stand for
> ਸੰਸਾਰ / ਜਗਤ and not for emotions.
> The compound ਭਵਸਾਗਰ or
> ਭਵਸਾਗਰ stands for ਸੰਸਾਰ
> ਸਾਗਰ or sea of worldliness or maya.
>
> ਬੂਡਤ ਸੰਸਾਰ ਸਾਗਰ ॥
> ਉਧਰੇ ਹਰਿ ਸਿਮਰਿ
> ਰਤਨਾਗਰ ॥੧॥ (SGGS ang 1301)

Quote
Bhawan gill
Being emotional is when you are under influence of Emotion and you can be very outrageous. "so-called Khalistanes" are example of being emotional within Sikhs or The video in Taksali Sikhs were beating up a old age drunk sikh Nihung. These singhs are actually want to do something better for Sikhi,but "Emotion" drags them to darkside of their job.

.

Vaheguroo Jee Kaa Khalsaa
Vaheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!

So are you saying that the shaheed soormey who gave their life, puratan or present, were being emotional?There is a difference between *standing for truth* and just *emotions*. No doubt emotions are must but Gurmat Sidhant teaches us to channelize these emotions based on the cause of emotions. Daya/Love (Bhao) for weak and poor. and similarly it should bring *Beer Ras* to fight for injustice(cruel) in a Gursikh.

Soora so pehchaniye, jo ladhe deen ke heit
Purja purja katt marre, kab hu na chhode khet

Coming back to the original topic of *Depression*, it can be caused because of the past karams, its not always in control of ones self. Scientifically it can be caused by imbalance in the chemicals of the brain. There is no doubt that * sarab rog kaa aukhad naam* but there is no harm in going to the worldly doctor and getting medicines in a control fashion. Ultimately Guru Sahib is the one who is going to give this *Jeev* permanent cure but taking worldly medicines in controlled fashion along with Naam and Bani is not against Gurmat. If one is worried about western medicine, once can try homoepathic/ayurvedic or alternative medicine, again it should be based on the comfort factor of the *rogi*.


Vaheguroo Jee Kaa Khalsaa
Vaheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!

How did this topic suddenly turn into "khalistan"???
Some people are so weird, first this poster attaches "gill" as a surname on a Gurmat based forum, then tries to explain the key concepts of Sikhi. Now this, brings up Khalistan???
He/she really doesn't make any sense!

Emotions are important. Every creature alive has emotions. If you don't feel anything, then something is wrong with you, and antidepressants do just that, they numb you, change your personality, etc, etc.

Gobind bhagat bhau ka bhukha (even God is hungry for love)..hope i'm not saying it all wrong.

It's our duty to keep a 'balance' of emotional state. This can be acheived through prayer to God.

NOT antidepressants, these drugs are no good.

I want to second the emtional-concern shown by Bhein Ji. Emotions are strong carriers, which carry us safely to GURU and GOD. We as human, are dead, without emotions. As we learn a language, with alphabet; so we learn BHAGTI through emotions.

Totally agree with you Singho! Please read my above posts, don't take me wrong or misleading. what I mentioned was two aspects of Emotion, so that i can differentiate them.
I clearly mentioned that without keeping emotions no one can really be a Sikh( hope i am not wrong though). Emotions are required to live as human being and to feel it and to actually Love someone.

But, I was talking about "being emotional" and that is totally negative side of our life. (people often cry in circumstances, and that can be worth False worldly satisfaction, or false cry while listening Gurbani (many people address it as BAIRAAG,but it isn't)

Better you do ardass to Guru Shaib and ask him to guide you,with regards to Emotion.

I can provide you with example if your interested in, but I am unable to explain it to you in words. May be because i am talking about something you can only feel, can't really express it.

Gresit requires you to have a physical relation and so is a above of all other DHARAMs,but on the other hand, if you be a KAAMI then you better know?
So, to be more specific/clear, can i say that keeping KAAM is dharam, but Being KAAMI is dark end.
Exactly goes for Emotion, keeping emotion is DAYA and Love and ANAKH (DHARAM),but being emotional is SELFISH,HUME,MOH and LUST totally dark end.

As soon as,things are under our(soul) control they are Dharama Karma,but when our MANN holds the power,its becomes PAAP karma. We gotta maintain our boundaries to be escaped of KALYUG.

It's actually a very broad topic to explain in details but I am trying to keep it somewhat short.

Well Dass is Kookar to Guru Sahib and my duty is to shout JAGDE RAHO and rest is upon you. if nothing seems to make any sense,then only NAAM Japo piyareo Guru Sahib ji Appe kirpa kernge!

Please guys - Chaupaui sahib is the answer to everything - our mind- emotions the whole lot do lot of abyhaas of it please

also check vahkyia of Chaupi sahib by Giani Kulwant singh jee listen to all parts:


[www.gianikulwantsingh.com]